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A quick test of first impressions! The image out of context!

Asher Kelman

OPF Owner/Editor-in-Chief
Jarmo,

Ken brought up the consideration of the context in which a picture is placed. I must admit, that looking at this picture in isolation is very different. I hope you don't mind me using your picture in a quick experiment.

_small.jpg

Guys, non-denominational, everyone!

I'd like to learn from what we think this might represent..... What ideas come to mind? Forget where you saw this before. Don't study it. Just glance.

What are the first thoughts?

Asher
 
I haven't seen this before now so my answer isn't tainted.

First thought: Tough lighting problem! Beyond that, It represents a window...that's all I can see.
 
To me it looks like a barn (for cows), and if there is lightning problem, I would had the same "problem" shooting it :). I like it that way.

I see the cows as they are grazing away and the silent barn empty of their moos. I can smell the odour of their uh....you know what, which is not disgusting. I can see the cat - out of the frame -licking the milk leftovers near the milking machine. I can see the man silent, tired and happy.


Of course if it's Birkenau, I don't know what to say. Only that I prefer flying away from the sad reality.
 

Ken Tanaka

pro member
The idea of an image's (or any piece of art) meaning to the viewer being derived in great part from the context of its surrounding body or work (if any) is ancient and fundamental to any art project.

However, the post to which Asher refers was actually not my observation of this but, rather, my complaint that a person had created an image that seemed utterly wild when compared to its siblings. Enough of that thread's tired discussion, which the photographer predictably discarded anyway, is more than enough of a life slice for me. Let's move way on.

Contrary to Asher's title and intro, this post is actually -not- about context. It's about what viewers bring to an image, any image. If I was teaching an advanced photography seminar this is one of five seminal lessons I would offer. (Perhaps mercifully, nobody's ever invited me to teach! ;-> )

Every image, even the most butt-simple snaps, invoke a very personalized response in the viewers' minds. This image is a good example. We look at this window, and its dark room, and we paint the rest of the picture. We imagine the building's appearance, its surroundings, the language of the voices we hear outside. (Yes, even Winston imagined such things for a moment.) This is an extremely important advanced point in art photography that 99% of the amateur snapping community utterly misses during their stampede to the newest dslr. It's also why the camera used matters hardly at all; the majority of the image is in the viewer's mind, at least for a moment.

Here's another, more renowned and highly crafted example. In the 1970's Japanese photographer Hiroshi Sugimoto created a series of movie theater images. The theaters are darkened and the screens are illuminated. But there is no image on the screen. Nor are there people in the seats. What do you see? That the b&w images were printed quite large makes them all the more immersive when viewed in the flesh.

hiroshi_sugimoto_ambiencia.jpg
Hiroshi Sugimoto, Theaters, Late 1970's​

The next time you look at renowned art photography that challenges your understanding or that you think is nonsensical consider the work from this cognitive psychology angle. More importantly, however, why not take a whirl at exploring creation of such work for yourself?
 

Asher Kelman

OPF Owner/Editor-in-Chief
Contrary to Asher's title and intro, this post is actually -not- about context. It's about what viewers bring to an image, any image. If I was teaching an advanced photography seminar this is one of five seminal lessons I would offer. (Perhaps mercifully, nobody's ever invited me to teach! ;-> )

My intention was to demonstrate that lack of context allows the viewer to bring their own sandwiches and their imagination; instinct, culture, experience and education takes over. You, of course, recognized the latter part of my equation, but missed the first.

very image, even the most butt-simple snaps, invoke a very personalized response in the viewers' minds.

Exactly!

This image is a good example. We look at this window, and its dark room, and we paint the rest of the picture. We imagine the building's appearance, its surroundings, the language of the voices we hear outside.

This is the mechanism and that's what we use in making the picture and in looking at it.

...... It's also why the camera used matters hardly at all; the majority of the image is in the viewer's mind, at least for a moment.

Well put!

Asher
 

Rachel Foster

New member
A good definition found here is “the incidental activation of knowledge structures, such as trait concepts and stereotypes, by the current situational context. . . " In effect, you can influence what a person will perceive by "priming." For example, if prior to seeing the photo Asher posted, viewers read a sentence with words like "manufacture", people would be far more likely to see the image as a factory.
 

Ken Tanaka

pro member
Thanks for that concise definition, Rachel. "Priming" sounds like a key factor of my earlier point.
"Priming, defined by the researchers as “the incidental activation of knowledge structures, such as trait concepts and stereotypes, by the current situational context,” can affect an individual‟s attitudes, behaviors, and even actions."
Here are two examples of what I meant by providing seeds of interpretive variations, perhaps drawing upon "priming".

(Both of these image are designed to be presented a bit larger than is reasonable here, so please excuse the smallness.)

p43563240-4.jpg

© Kenneth Tanaka

Some viewers will see this as a scene of peaceful solittude. Some will look at this young man's stiff posture, black shirt, and his apparent spacial isolation and read it as a scene portraying mental or emotional illness. Still others will barely notice the young man and just wonder why the trees are in a cage. I created this image very intentionally to present such interpretive possibilities.

Let's look at one more

p269012073-4.jpg

© Kenneth Tanaka

The impression this image makes will likely depend on your gender, your marital status (or your perspectives on such committed relationships), your parental status, and probably several other factors. Interestingly, although not scientifically, younger women tend to zoom-in on the man in the background carrying a baby (boy) with such a loving, comforting gesture. Younger men zone-in on the woman in the foreground reading a paper while walking. Most think she's reading a want-ad section! There has been some debate over whether or not they're related. The manicured boxed trees against that stark background lends a further dimension for interpretive possibilities.

This was also very intentional. It often takes very few visual elements to create a resonance far beyond what you present in an image.

Am I making my point or droning?
 

Rachel Foster

New member
Your point is a good one and worth exploring. But there are many, many factors involved in determining how we perceive a stimulus. Priming is only one. Freud said behavior is multiply determined. So, not only will recent events (priming) affect our interpretation, so will our past history, our mood, etc. etc. etc.

By the way....


inkblot.png

Rorschach-like inkblot, found here.
 

Ken Tanaka

pro member
Your point is a good one and worth exploring. But there are many, many factors involved in determining how we perceive a stimulus. Priming is only one. Freud said behavior is multiply determined. So, not only will recent events (priming) affect our interpretation, so will our past history, our mood, etc. etc. etc.

By the way....

Rorschach-like inkblot, found.

Yes, indeed. A very small, but very enjoyable, winter project along those lines. (You have to imagine how many odd stares I drew as I photographed pavement cracking and crazing in downtown Chicago in the dead of winter.)
 

Rachel Foster

New member
I love those! That's exactly the sort of thing that captivates me.


I'm still trying to figure out how to capture this.

smallhoop-1.jpg


Hoop: Jacob Eliana

It's very different from the sidewalk photos and not at all like a Rorschach, but it's not the sort of thing most people shoot.
 

Asher Kelman

OPF Owner/Editor-in-Chief
Yes, indeed. A very small, but very enjoyable, winter project along those lines. (You have to imagine how many odd stares I drew as I photographed pavement cracking and crazing in downtown Chicago in the dead of winter.)
Ken,

That visit to the pictures of patterns on the frozen pavement is worthwhile and that everyone should make. Kudos to you! Interesting that I have been doing the same in sunny California, in the absence of ice, using shadow and the yellow lines on the roadway. I'll start a new thread shortly.

BTW, I really like the form of your gallery with the block on the right. Programmed by you or commercially available?

Asher
 

Asher Kelman

OPF Owner/Editor-in-Chief
p43563240-4.jpg

© Kenneth Tanaka

p269012073-4.jpg

© Kenneth Tanaka

This was also very intentional. It often takes very few visual elements to create a resonance far beyond what you present in an image.

Am I making my point or droning?

I am enjoying this sequence. There's a thrust in a counter clockwise movement to the first picture given that we likely look at the entire right side and back to the left and then stop on the man on the bench. He's stationary and the trees are locked away. So, to me, there's now tension and prescience for more movement. The second picture shows a continuation of that anti-clockwise movement and the girl is leading it. It moved so fast for me that I missed the man with the child, passing behind the tree!

Even then, I still saw the girl as the main character! That's perhaps my fixation, even happily married as I am. After all, she's moving, free, energetic like my daughters in law and the folk I photograph.

The guys in the back? My sons with the grandkids!

Asher
 

Ken Tanaka

pro member
Ken,

....

BTW, I really like the form of your gallery with the block on the right. Programmed by you or commercially available?

Asher
Customized Zenfolio layouts. (I'm really, really liking Zenfolio as an alternative to fully custom galleries or to the pricey-but-rigid LiveBooks.)

See, now you've immediately come away with an entirely new "first impression"; that of a counter-clockwise pattern to these images! As Rachel noted earlier, perception is a very complex topic, isn't it?
 

Rachel Foster

New member
Number Nine is my favorite. But I wonder if giving them names might detract from the viewers' experience? I would have been tempted to leave it wide open by not naming them.
 

fahim mohammed

Well-known member
Asher's thoughts, past events that might have shaped his thinking.

Objects do not exist in a vacuum. To have objectivity, one needs to bring all the past learning and experience to bear on the object being considered. The are necessarily intertwined.

Studying something in a vacuum is an exercise in futility. Matter and thought detest a vacuum. There is no such thing as a vacuum per se.

This photo reminds me of the past. Dreadful things. Dark. Sinister. Inhuman. The depths of human bestiality.

Jarmo,

Ken brought up the consideration of the context in which a picture is placed. I must admit, that looking at this picture in isolation is very different. I hope you don't mind me using your picture in a quick experiment.

_small.jpg

Guys, non-denominational, everyone!

I'd like to learn from what we think this might represent..... What ideas come to mind? Forget where you saw this before. Don't study it. Just glance.

What are the first thoughts?

Asher
 

Asher Kelman

OPF Owner/Editor-in-Chief
Asher's thoughts, past events that might have shaped his thinking.

Objects do not exist in a vacuum. To have objectivity, one needs to bring all the past learning and experience to bear on the object being considered. The are necessarily intertwined.

Studying something in a vacuum is an exercise in futility. Matter and thought detest a vacuum. There is no such thing as a vacuum per se.

This photo reminds me of the past. Dreadful things. Dark. Sinister. Inhuman. The depths of human bestiality.

Fahim,

Your eloquent words have resonance. When I read your reaction I remembered something seemingly mundane. A feature of my car that I didn't know protected me!

My car has, much to my surprise a chemical sensor that shuts of air intake if noxious fumes are detected. I discovered that after passing a giant cattle waiting yard packed with cattle and mounds of waste that hardly caught my attention. We stopped at a gas station just after passing the place and when we opened the doors we were hit by a wall of stench!

Then I though of the song, Donna Donna, made famous by by Joan Baez and translated into other languages, even Vietanamese!

- a story of a farmer binding a calf to go to market to be slaughtered while up above the birds fly free!

This is the English version of the song Dona Dona that is available in Hebrew and Yiddish on this site. (search for Dona)

Originally a Yiddish song, but made popular in the 60s by Joan Baez's English version . . . Translation of the Yiddish song "Dos Kelbl", decrying the condition of Russian Jews pogroms in the early part of the 20th century.

Donna Donna (Dona Dona) –
On a wagon bound for market -
There's a calf with a mournful eye –
High above him there's a swallow -
Winging swiftly through the sky

Refrain: How the winds are laughing -
They laugh with all their might Laugh and laugh the whole day through -
And half the summer's night Donna donna donna donna,
donna donna donna don, donna donna donna donna, donna donna donna don

Stop complaining said the farmer
"Who told you a calf to be?
Why don't you have wings to fly with Like the swallow so proud and free?"

Refrain

Calves are easily bound and slaughtered
Never knowing the reason why
But whoever treasures freedom
Like the swallow has learned to fly

Refrain composer S. Secunda

Egel rach kashur bechevel
Al ha'agala mutal Ulemala bashamayim
Efronim mamri-im el al Ruach stav tzochek lo
Tzochek umit-holel Tzchok ootzchok miboker or
Ve'ad chatzi haleyl

Dona dona,-- dona dona dona do-ona Dona dona dona do
Dona dona dona do-ona Dona dona dona do...
"Al teetlonen" omer ikar Leehyot egel mee l'cha amar?
Lamah ayn l'cha knafayim
C'mo efron chofshi v'nehedar?

Ruach stav tzochek lo Tzochek oomitholel
Tchak utzchak miboker or
Ve-ad chatzi haleyl
Agalim Bli Da'at Lama
El hatevach hochlim tamid
Va'asher libam lachofesh
Mamri-im ke-efronim
Ruach Stav Tzochek lo Tzochek umit-holel
Tzchok ootzchok miboker or Ve-ad chatzi haleyl

Dona chorus


Then my mind came back to the men women and children led into "showers", and then the gas canisters where thrown in. They were crying to God, scraping the concrete wall to no avail.

Art allows all such memories to populate the pictures space. The artist not only brings a work of imagination, (itself impressive and entertaining), to others but also opens a space for us to use our own imagination. My take-away message is as follows:

It's important for us to look beyond the behavior of others, where faults are obvious. The more civilized we are, we'll look within ourselves too and take account of what we do to others, how our lives impact theirs. We can have very different ideas of what constitutes "civilization". Here's one example:

As our repeatedly delayed plane from Lagos, Nigeria, safely touched down to cheers, in London's Heathrow Airport, I overheard, "Glad to be back in civilization!" I cheered too, as I had thought we'd never even get off the ground! I was stone broke after being cheated by the travel agent (and tricked at a restaurant where he sent a beautiful Portuguese-Africandancer-singer to distract me while he slipped out of the back door, LOL)! The British embassy lent me the money on condition I'd escort back an acohol-worn out expat who had no place in a country where he could no longer insult and abuse the house staff with impunity. "Civilization!" To me that's an interesting concept, I thought.

"Flushing toilets, contact lenses and garage door openers do not make us civilized. These are just the offshoots of modernity.

When I look at the dark picture with that window separating us from the sky, I think of freedom and justice and our own values. It has a strong meaning for me, beyond the memories it evokes and this it:

We must also update our view of the world. There's a tendency, in all our varied societies, for those with power and resources, yes, even ourselves, to become blind to cruelty, direct and indirect, overt and covert, by intent and inadvertent. We must, therefore, always seek, against all odds, a higher moral ground than brute power and the chance of birth allows us. Being civilized is a struggle not a static end in itself.

Asher
 

Prateek Dubey

New member
Jarmo,

Ken brought up the consideration of the context in which a picture is placed. I must admit, that looking at this picture in isolation is very different. I hope you don't mind me using your picture in a quick experiment.

_small.jpg

Guys, non-denominational, everyone!

I'd like to learn from what we think this might represent..... What ideas come to mind? Forget where you saw this before. Don't study it. Just glance.

What are the first thoughts?

Asher

Hello Guruji,
Is an emotional response thoughtful? Most of the time, when a subject appeals to me, there are no thoughts crossing my mind. This picture, for example draws a blank as far as emotional connect is concerned, so I have to think whether there lies something under the 'undisturbed'. After spending a minute, I concluded that it was the lines which attracted me in the photo, but the first thoughts eluded me.
I must share an example. A friend of mine, non participating, phlegmetic sort of a fellow is a lawyer who wakes up whenever one speaks of the mountains. He loves to trek. But he is not interested in photography, nor does he bring back a single interesting narrative, story, poem or a sketch. He's like " Oh! it snowed on the 10th". There is no doubt an emotional response within him, but the need to express it doesn't arise. What I wish to say is that the 'art' is in the expression. The expression has to communicate. Theatre pictures perhaps will not work if printed small, and so if this image were to be a wall size, it will create a substantial impact, where the need for a thought might not arise.
 

Kevin Stecyk

New member
Here are two YouTubes that show an interview with Jock Sturges:

1) http://bit.ly/afTiP4

2) http://bit.ly/9xBaY7

He discusses how an American and Spaniard will react differently to seeing images. I enjoyed these two videos.

Be warned, however, that the videos are meant for mature audiences. Translation: Likely not safe for work.
 

Jarmo Juntunen

Well-known member
However, the post to which Asher refers was actually not my observation of this but, rather, my complaint that a person had created an image that seemed utterly wild when compared to its siblings. Enough of that thread's tired discussion, which the photographer predictably discarded anyway, is more than enough of a life slice for me. Let's move way on.?

Ken, 104 views and 0 comments. I do call that a tired discussion.

As for the picture I took I shall leave commenting to others.
 

Jarmo Juntunen

Well-known member
On a second thought I think I will join this discussion, after all. I must say that this image has been haunting my mind ever since I took it. To me it has a Tarkovskian feeling. Nothing is really what it appears to be at the first glance. And yet, things usually are exactly what they appear to be. Like many of you have already put it, and I dare say in a more eloquent way I'll ever be able to, it's all a matter of perspective. When I entered this barn I felt really odd. I knew that in only a few minutes (literally) the cows would arrive and make the place full of life and noise (the smell was there, all right). But for the time being it was an abandoned place that had no relationship what so ever to its' actual purpose and function.
 

Ken Tanaka

pro member
Nice to hear from the shooter!

Since we've gone this far on this topic there is one more point that's worth noting. The "mystery" of this image is largely a contrivance of tonal manipulation. That is, if you had not crushed the bordering deep tones we would see that there are cattle stalls on the right and perhaps other details that assert the agricultural context.

This is not a criticism, Jarmo. I'm merely calling-out this aspect so that onlookers can consider its potential application in their own photos. To bastardize an old design chestnut, sometimes less can be more.
 
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