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  • Welcome to the new site. Here's a thread about the update where you can post your feedback, ask questions or spot those nasty bugs!

Eizo out, NEC in!

John_Nevill

New member
After 2.5 years of using Eizo S2100 LCD monitors, I decided to move on up to a new NEC MultiSync® LCD2690WUXi.

25.5" of desktop at 1920x1600, crystal clear 0.287mm pixel pitch, 12bit LUTs, 36bit Gamma correction and colour control (via hardware), 95% AdobeRGB and a H-IPS panel to boot.

gamut.jpg

Yellow = AdobeRGB, Colour = NEC

Its gorgeous!

Pricey, yep!, but considering the amount of time I sit in front of it, It works out at ~8 pence (15c) an hour over 3 years.
 

John_Nevill

New member
Hi Asher, no problem!

gamut2.jpg


White = AdobeRGB
Grey = NEC 2690
Yellow = Eizo CG210

These are OEM ICC profiles plots, the earlier one was the NEC 2690 calibrated.

The only issue one has with wide gamut monitors is in general application use. e.g. games and browsers etc. AFAIK, only Safari and Firefox 3 beta are colour aware.
I don't do PC games so its not really and issue and I'm also running Firefox 3 beta 5.
 

Andrew Rodney

New member
The only issue one has with wide gamut monitors is in general application use. e.g. games and browsers etc. AFAIK, only Safari and Firefox 3 beta are colour aware.
I don't do PC games so its not really and issue and I'm also running Firefox 3 beta 5.

You can switch to the sRGB "mode" which may help there (you can't calibrate using that mode).

Those gamut maps look oddly truncated.
 

John_Nevill

New member
Those gamut maps look oddly truncated.

Andrew, I used the OEM ICC profiles off the respective websites. Feel free to check them. (EDIT: scaling was wrong)

Perhaps, we should compare calibrated profiles to get a more realistic view.

BTW, thanks for the sRGB tip.

Do you use the NEC?, I'm guessing that you have a Spectraview 2690.

I've read the NEC 2690s use the LG-Philips H-IPS panels. Unlike the Eizos which use Samsung PVAs panels (L, CE and S range) and Hitachi S-IPS panels(CG range).

There's a lot internet chatter regarding what's best. I went for the NEC purely on value for money and high specification. Plus tha fact I saw it up at NEC FOI in February and thought yep that's the one for me!
 
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Doug Kerr

Well-known member
Hi, John,

Hi Asher, no problem!

Are those chromaticity gamuts at the maximum attainable "luminance" for any given chromaticity (the "chromaticity projection" of the color gamut solid, what we usually have when we see "full triangle" chromaticity gamuts), or at some arbitrary fixed "luminance", or what?

Thanks.

Best regards,

Doug
 

John_Nevill

New member
Hi Doug,

The latter graphs are for D65 and Gamma at 2.2. Luminance is not stated, however most manufacturers issue OEM profiles based on default (max) cd/m2 settings.

The former graph (NEC 2690) is also at D65 and Gamma at 2.2, but the luminance is set at 140cd/m2 yielding a contrast ratio of 523:1 with black level of 0.28cd/m2 and DeltaE of 2.1.

Bear in mind the NEC 2690 was calibrated after only 1 hrs use, so really, the 2nd or even 3rd calibration should show better results, as the monitor will be run in and more settled.

EDIT: 2nd Calibration after 17.5 hours usage and switching on ColourComp (screen uniformity correction) reduced DeltaE to 0.34.
 
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Doug Kerr

Well-known member
The gamut solid

Hi, John,

Hi Doug,

The latter graphs are for D65 and Gamma at 2.2. Luminance is not stated, however most manufacturers issue OEM profiles based on default (max) cd/m2 settings.

The former graph (NEC 2690) is also at D65 and Gamma at 2.2, but the luminance is set at 140cd/m2 yielding a contrast ratio of 523:1 with black level of 0.28cd/m2 and DeltaE of 2.1.

No, that's not what I mean.

The actual color gamut of an output device is a three-dimensional "plot" (sometimes called the "gamut solid"). It could be done in different coordinate systems. One of those would be the CIE xyY coordinate system.

The graphs you show (and that we most often see) are two-dimensional - they show chromaticity only, showing the x and y coordinates only.

But those could be derived in several ways from the entire three-dimensional plot. For example, they could show the "cross section" of the three-dimensional solid at some value of Y (luminance) - (not the luminance setting of the monitor - a luminance value on the "Y" axis of the color solid).

Or they could be the "x-y envelope" of the three-dimensional solid - its overall outline as we would see it by observation from "high overhead" (that is, from a point of observation at a high value of Y).

The practical significance of all this is that we cannot necessarily get all chromaticities lying within the "chromaticity gamut" plot with every possible luminance. The classical example is that the highest luminance color usually available on a display is at its "white point", and we can only have that high a luminance for a color with the "white point" chromaticity. If we want come other chromaticity, it will have to be at a lower luminance.

In fact the "gamut" plots that are a triangle that are only a triangle joining the chromaticity of the three primaries of the display (the "phosphor" chromaticities, for a CRT display). We can only get all the chromaticities lying within that triangle if we are willing to limit ourselves to a maximum luminance attainable for each.

In fact, one of the reasons that some two-dimensional chromaticity gamuts look "truncated" is that they are in fact a "slice" of the three-dimensional color gamut solid at some arbitrary l(but "fairly high") luminance, where not all chromaticities within the "triangle" can be attained.

But of course to understand such a plot, we need to know at what luminance (on a relative basis, usually stated as a fraction of the luminance available at the "white point" chromaticity) it is a "slice" of the solid.

Best regards,

Doug
 

Doug Kerr

Well-known member
Hi, John,

Doug, Valid point, I understand and will add the 3D plots later today.

I knew you understood all that - my comment was mostly for the benefit of the onlookers!

But it will be interesting to see the "3D" gamuts.

Thanks.

Best regards,

Doug
 

John_Nevill

New member
Doug,

3D gamut plots - Two views for each profile. AdobeRGB gamut is in translucent red.

NEC 2690

NEC1.jpg

NEC2.jpg


The NEC 2690 partial exceeds AdobeRGB gamut in green, yellow and blue spectrum


Eizo CG210

CG1.jpg

CG2.jpg


The Eizo CG210 is pretty much engulfed by AdobeRGB colourspace, with the marginal exception of blue / green region.

To be fair, the Eizo is not designated a wide gamut LCD monitor.

A more appropriate Eizo comparison would be the either the new CG241W ($$$$) or the new SX2761W.
 
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John_Nevill

New member
For comparative purposes, here are the gamut plots of the new Eizo CG241W.

cg21-1.jpg

cg21-2.jpg


The Eizo CG 241W also exceeds AdobeRGB gamut in green, yellow and blue spectrum, but there's doesn't appear to be significant differences between this and the NEC 2690wuxi.
 

Asher Kelman

OPF Owner/Editor-in-Chief
The Eizo CG 241W also exceeds AdobeRGB gamut in green, yellow and blue spectrum, but there's doesn't appear to be significant differences between this and the NEC 2690wuxi.

John,

How does the gamut compare to the K3 or other inks on the papers you use?

Asher
 

John_Nevill

New member
Quite surprising really.

Here's my old Eizo S2100 v HPB9180 Hahnemühle Fine Art Baryta paper:

efab.jpg


The ink/paper combination exceeds what can be soft proofed in the green/blue and and yellow spectrum.

Whereas, on the NEC 2690 there is significantly less "Out of Gamut" (look at the blue line)

necfab.jpg


Bear in mind, Baryta papers exceed most other papers for gamut anyway.

If one were to compare the NEC 2690 (or any wide gamut LCD) with some of the matte papers, they would note that these displays by and large exceed the paper gamuts.

So its probably fair to assume that one gets a more colour accurate softproofing in applications like photoshop. (Doug, is this a fair assumption?)
 
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Asher Kelman

OPF Owner/Editor-in-Chief
Quite surprising really.

Here's my old Eizo S2100 v HPB9180 Hahnemühle Fine Art Baryta paper:

efab.jpg


The ink/paper combination exceeds what can be soft proofed in the green/blue and and yellow spectrum.

Whereas, on the NEC 2690 there is significantly less "Out of Gamut" (look at the blue line)

necfab.jpg


Bear in mind, Baryta papers exceed most other papers for gamut anyway.

If one were to compare the NEC 2690 (or any wide gamut LCD) with some of the matte papers, they would note that these displays by and large exceed the paper gamuts.

So its probably fair to assume that one gets a more colour accurate softproofing in applications like photoshop. (Doug, is this a fair assumption?)
John,

I just noticed this reply! could you or anyone confirm my reading of the graphs? It seems that the brown is the Gamut of the printed image and the red lower outline is its perimeter carried down to the lower plane as a reference and the blue is the outer edge of the blue component of the monitor's gamut.

This is a most helpful post, just wish I'd seen it earlier. :) I wonder whether the CG210, (my monitor) would still cover that paper's gamut?,

Asher
 
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