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death personified

Daniel Buck

New member
A little project of mine that I've been wanting to do for quite some time now! These are the first 4 shots (8x10, with various lenses), I've got another 4 8x10 shots yet to develop (which have more motion blur, including two hand-held 8x10 shots, haha!) as well as some 4x5 yet to develop. I will add them to this thread later this week when I have time to develop and scan.

I was a little disappointed when I first saw the cloak on my friend once we got into the woods, it left me with a little bit of a "disgruntled monk" look instead of a "death" look, but I am please with the images so far. As pointed out by some on a different forum (which pretty much mirror my feelings) some of the shots look a little hokey and staged, this was one thing I struggled with. The next batch to be developed will have more motion blur attempts, hopefully some of those will look a little less staged :)

I would love to hear some comments, positive, negative or neutral. On the compositions, subject portrayal, effects from the lenses, or anything :) I'm contemplating trying this again now that I have done it once I may be able to reduce the 'staged' look on a 2nd attempt. We'll see how the rest turn out :)


harvester_01.jpg


harvester_02.jpg


harvester_03.jpg


harvester_04.jpg
 
the first one looked like model, must be a large format because of DOF, the last one is my favorite but composition could have been less direct ... wait a minute, I'm posting w/out reading first, I went and read and yes, it is a LF... and you are working on the "stage" factor, so disregard me... : )
 

Asher Kelman

OPF Owner/Editor-in-Chief
Crtique of Death Personifed

............I would love to hear some comments, positive, negative or neutral. On the compositions, subject portrayal, effects from the lenses, or anything :) I'm contemplating trying this again now that I have done it once I may be able to reduce the 'staged' look on a 2nd attempt. We'll see how the rest turn out :)

Here's the 4th photograph:

harvester_04.jpg

You have set for yourself a most ambitious creative and original project with your large format film photography. When you reach your goal, you will be rewarded with a great sense of accomplishment and satisfaction.

The First 3 pictures as you've pointed out appear staged to show "being staged" and are fine for the history of the project when completed. This forth image, at least gives us an idea that death might be coming.

The old car wreck, of course is full of character signifying the fate of all things with passage of time. I won’t address the technical characteristics of the picture, as yet, since technique, alone, will enhance a good concept not often construct it.

The basic idea of demonstrating a materialized figure of "Death" is to see how one defines characters in other dramatic situations. After all, this picture is not merely about the physicality of the subject and composition, but rather to their associated ideas. These are mythology of dying, the concept of time, the idea of personification this to a character who is their waiting at the end of a human's mortal existence. More than that,"Death" personified, has a character and plans. Death is not, AFAIK defined as male of female with any certainty, but for sure, Death stalks folks and has an idea of when the clock of life runs out. Death can wait and beckon. Maybe death can intervene too and "collect" on a forgotten Faustian Bargain made with the devil years back for some temporary gain or advantage.

In a drama, one can cast the part to a person having the physique and able to show a manner of doing things and a tone and meter of voice consistent with that character. One can build the character by the content of speech and by hearing of past deeds and intent. All this is best reinforced or even bettered, by the words and deeds of others, especially minor characters who, having no great stake in the outcome of the drama, are considered relatively impartial.

Well here whom else do we have. The figure, resembling death, suitably blurred to create and idea of uncertainty of a figure from the spirit world, is show against the living woods and a dead car.

Certainly, there's no mythology to let us imagine that the trees are at risk of being called by Death. Likewise, the wreck of the wonderful car is way beyond calling time, even if it had been previously made into a anthropomorphic being as is out wont at least in comic books and TV cartoons or advertisements for Pennzoil™.

So how do we bring to realism this specter of "Death"?

My suggestion is for example a distraught man standing on a bridge, perhaps about to jump, but not yet having made up his mind or having the nerve to carry out his intent. Then one could have people looking on in horror and someone pleading with him. One little girl looks to the shadows and there, with his sickle, waits the figure of "Death".

That, contrasting real life at an uncertain turning point and a minor character observing the real tragic meaning of things, brings the personage of "Death" to a believable, breathing form with plans expectations, memory, patience and intent to welcome those that have rolled the dice on a bad day.

So one can construct a scenario in the woods with the same concept but form your own imagination. Then you have a death personified!

Asher
 

Rod Witten

pro member
In the last image, I see the Grim Reaper revisiting his past glories. His own state of deterioration creeping into the recall. The old scythe isn't as sharp as it once was and his hand is unsteadied by a carpal disease of overuse. He's missed his last two quotas and the bank has called his mortgage. He now regrets that he refused a pass for his financial advisor. :=)

Love the head blur!!!
 

Charlotte Thompson

Well-known member
Daniel

I like most the first- it brings our attention to the fact that maybe death doesn't lurk so much in our face
as he/she/whatever-looms quietly in the background ever watchful
but of course as an icon-death catches constantly and never can stop for everything else would-
so for me this would hang back in constant movement-(death) it is a cycle that follows life- no?
what if death had the partner life along side-

Charlotte-
 

Daniel Buck

New member
Alright, here's the rest of the shots! I wasn't happy with a few others, so I've left them out.

1st shot I think I held the shutter open to long, all you see is a darkening in the pathway, instead of something more definable. I think I had him walking to fast and covering to much ground, so he nearly just walked right through the exposure without affecting it as much as I would have liked. In retrospect, if I were to do it again I would have him walk normal paced and then get slower and slower (over about 7-8 seconds) until he came to a complete stop for the last or so second of the photo, to give him the illusion of speed. I'm tempted to try this shot again with that technique. Also, for this shot I underexposed (quite a bit) and then brought it back up in the scan (I did this once by accident, and found that it gave a creepy contrast). And I also held a few sheets of ND gel infront of the lens, but 1/2 an inch away or so, to get some ghosting/glare effect on the film. That last two parts to get the creepy look actually seemed to work!

2nd and 3rd shots were hand held 8x10, first walking around in a circle (about 45 degrees) around my subject for the 2nd shot, and then for the 3rd shot one walking backwards with my subject pacing with me in front of the camera. 210 xenar on these, by the way.

4th shot, is my least favorite of the 'keepers' I have uploaded. I'm not sure what I don't like about it, I think it just looks a little like the 'accidental out-of-focus' shots you see on alien photographs or big-foot photographs. Maybe just a bit to hokey?


harvester_05.jpg


harvester_06.jpg


harvester_07.jpg


harvester_08.jpg
 

Charlotte Thompson

Well-known member
Most I love the last
how wonderful that-
impression
of death-
nothing

we really don't understand- I think that shot gives us that cloud of not knowing*

but I like " getting out of that ever lovin' box-

Charlotte-
 

Doug Earle

New member
the word that comes to mind to me is "cliche"-----except for the last one, where I think you are on to something.

you have a good eye for the landscape composition. the problem is the disgruntled monk/death. To me, the character is too prominent and detracts from the really interesting landscape/dead car, etc.

How about using slow shutters, have your monk keep moving, have a blurred figure in the perifery, background or extreme foreground? The landscape has a rich darkness to it already, all we need is a hint to bring our fears of the night and unknown into consciousness.
 

Daniel Buck

New member
I agree Doug! If I try this again, I'm going to play with longer shutter speeds. maybe not as long as the hand-held 10second shots I did, but locking the camera down and leaving the shutter open for a few seconds have have my subject move in different ways. The one shot where the subject is almost completely blurred out, I think I had him walk to great of a distance, so that he almost entirely blured out of the scene, hardly registering on the film. I think if I do that one again, I'll have him walk fast and then slowly come to a stop, so that he is more visible at the end of his motion and trails off to completely transparent. That would probably give a very creepy sense of speed I think.
 

james sperry

New member
hello daniel,
while 'death' is a hard subject for myself to talk about, i don't feel that it's fair to you to keep my feelings about these images from you.
when i see these images, they remind me that death can be anywhere in the path of life. one photo in particular has the hint of "which path you take, decides your fate". the close proximity of the foliage emphasizes the fact that once death is there, there is very little chance of escape. at the same time, the camera position gives a feeling that someone has the ability to see when death is coming or that somebody is cheating death. personally, i would say this thread is a 'break from cliche'.
don't get me wrong with this statement but, have you tried ways of trying to get more highlites off the wrinkles in the cloak?
 

james sperry

New member
lol..... oooooops

i'm horrible with words ..... try to get more highlights on the cloak. as in show more wrinkles below the shoulders. :) ... sorry!
 
Surely way way too dark. My monitor is an old CRT but it seems to give reasonably bright pictures of other things. Death isn't scary when it's wrapped in blackness and you can't see it coming. I know if I set up a performance featuring death she would be dressed in white; sharp, clear, and terrible.

Frankly I would exchange the opportunity of seeing these pictures for the privilege of being at the shoot itself. As performance art it could carry a chilling reminder that it is less confronting to look at photographs of death than be in the presence of death whether mimed or real.
 

Ken Tanaka

pro member
Since Maris has opened the conceptual aspect of this subject to discussion (and since Daniel may no longer be engaged in the conversation) I offer a few other thoughts.

The original image is indeed rather a cliché vision of death as a personified character...in this case the centuries-old "Grim Reaper" (or a character from Lord of the Rings?). This type of portrayal might give children nightmares but as one gets older, or encounters more real death, it looks a bit passé.

The worst horror of death, at least to me, is not the end itself; it's the potential suffering preamble. Asher, as a doctor whose (former?) specialty is particularly laden with death-and-suffering, would certainly have an experienced perspective on this subject. That's hard to portray in anything other than a documentary fashion, the horror of which is often too horrible to be frightening (if that makes sense).

But the next layer of deaths' horrors lies in the minds of survivors. The absence of someone can be a frightening and horrible prospect. A couple of years ago, at an exhibition of noteworthy young photographers' work at the Art Institute of Chicago I saw a truly striking body of images by Angela Strassheim. They were mostly large color prints of the clothes of recently-deceased people. (All were women, a shortcoming for which I jokingly poked Ms. Strassheim.) These were simple, elegant still life scenes. A "favorite" dress would be laid out on a bed, as if being readied to wear. A blouse and skirt would be on a chair, perhaps with shoes nearby. As a viewer of the image, we had no idea who these people were or what they looked like, details that Angela carefully guarded. But, knowing that these were well-worn clothes of recently deceased women, you could not help feeling the owners' presence, like someone who has just left the room you're in.

These images have vividly stayed in my psyche. They're not "horror" images. No, they carry a much more penetrating and indelible meaning of the concept of "death" than any grim reaper picture.
 

Asher Kelman

OPF Owner/Editor-in-Chief
Since Maris has opened the conceptual aspect of this subject to discussion (and since Daniel may no longer be engaged in the conversation) I offer a few other thoughts.

The original image is indeed rather a cliché vision of death as a personified character...in this case the centuries-old "Grim Reaper" (or a character from Lord of the Rings?). This type of portrayal might give children nightmares but as one gets older, or encounters more real death, it looks a bit passé.
As cliché as it might be, the grim reaper is, (whether or not we want it in our iconography), embedded and referenced as readily as a crucifix or a heart with an arrow from Eros. But we can agree, at least, that it is an unsubtle shortcut!

We don't like to do that. Men, for example, may invite a single attractive woman for coffee. The lack of details of the consequences of the "coffee" allows all of us to bring to that meeting all levels of consequence. Such courtesy built into a picture recruits our imagination and that, IMHO, could be one of the main purposes of art, acting as a gymnasium for the senses, "gymnasium sensoticum", so to speak. I like Latin sounding names and it allows me to imagine a set of architecture in the world of each work of art in which our imagination can explore numerous possibilities.

The worst horror of death, at least to me, is not the end itself; it's the potential suffering preamble. Asher, as a doctor whose (former?) specialty is particularly laden with death-and-suffering, would certainly have an experienced perspective on this subject. That's hard to portray in anything other than a documentary fashion, the horror of which is often too horrible to be frightening (if that makes sense).
Fighting to breathe, struggling in pain or being humiliated in an institution are fears we have of the process of death. That's why people have a wish to die in sleep or occasionally as Rockerfeller did, in passion with a lover. In a sick way, perhaps, these ideas of salvation, entrance to heaven and passion all combine in the perfect storm of the programmed homicide bomber’s destructive end.

Let me add two further aspects of death.

  1. We fear dying irrelevant: Self-made men try to build monuments to their virtue and stature in the last portion of their life. At the very least, we'd like to be valued by a hand present at the time of dying. Dying alone is not being able to say goodbye. That is a fear we have. We need an affirmation that we have significance, to the last moments, even in our frail state as we leave.
  2. Fear of Eternal Damnation: Next, as a result of pharahonic and Semitic ideas of an afterlife or heaven, we have been conditioned to fear damnation of our souls. This obsession with death and the promise of redemption by intercession of princely figures is imprinted via creeds to detailed conditions for entry to the desired safer, upper, more distinguished and exalted levels of post-life existence.
I was attending a dying patient at her home monitoring her pain. She was comfortable. She said she felt she was slipping away and asked my to say the "Lord's Prayer" with her. Having gone to a school in the U.K., I had heard this prayer over and over again. So I recited it for her as she labored her last breaths smiling in comfort at being received with grace. When I reached the last verse:

"For thine is the kingdom, the power and the...."

She sat bolt upright! "You're supposed to be dying", I protested, "Lie down and be comfortable again!"

"I'm Catholic" she protested, "That last verse is an insult to the Pope by the reformers. Start all over again but leave out that rubbish at the end!"

So I did and she passed away with grace.

So there are conditions for believers that are important parts of our fears, the threat of perpetual damnation. This is the essence of Danté's epic. In the "Inferno" man is faced with ever deeper and more depraved levels of demeaning situations and pain.

The other side of the coin, the loss by the rest of us, how to show this:

But the next layer of deaths' horrors lies in the minds of survivors. The absence of someone can be a frightening and horrible prospect. A couple of years ago, at an exhibition of noteworthy young photographers' work at the Art Institute of Chicago I saw a truly striking body of images by Angela Strassheim. They were mostly large color prints of the clothes of recently deceased people. (All were women, a shortcoming for which I jokingly poked Ms. Strassheim.) These were simple, elegant still life scenes. A "favorite" dress would be laid out on a bed, as if being readied to wear. A blouse and skirt would be on a chair, perhaps with shoes nearby. As a viewer of the image, we had no idea who these people were or what they looked like, details that Angela carefully guarded. But, knowing that these were well-worn clothes of recently deceased women, you could not help feeling the owners' presence, like someone who has just left the room you're in.
These are the concepts, I believe behind Imants K.'s set of images, arranged linearly, referenced in his thread, here.

How to guide the mind of the viewer? Our minds are able to look up legends, stories, and history, reference mythological characters and iconic images from art all in seconds of the presence of carefully laid out clues. The latter is the job of the artist, to exploit what we know, love, hope for, treasure and will miss or will not be present for.

Thanks, Ken for approaching this complex idea beyond the superficiality of the man with the scythe! To translate this to photography is a worthwhile challenge.

Asher
 

Daniel Buck

New member
I wasn't really thinking about it to deeply (I never really do when I'm photographing), but I do agree a few of them are a bit to 'cheesy' for what I had in mind. I may try and do this again, I'm not sure if I'll have time though, I'm already moved on to other things :) Thanks for the additional replies though :)
 

Asher Kelman

OPF Owner/Editor-in-Chief
I wasn't really thinking about it to deeply (I never really do when I'm photographing), but I do agree a few of them are a bit to 'cheesy' for what I had in mind. I may try and do this again, I'm not sure if I'll have time though, I'm already moved on to other things :) Thanks for the additional replies though :)
Daniel,

I don't think of the pictures as cheesy. We're just rather harsh and test where something might be taken beyond what we see. Having said that, I find your pictures interesting and challenging to my own thinking. after all, look at the discussion sparked by your pictures!

Asher
 

Daniel Buck

New member
Daniel,

I don't think of the pictures as cheesy. We're just rather harsh and test where something might be taken beyond what we see. Having said that, I find your pictures interesting and challenging to my own thinking. after all, look at the discussion sparked by your pictures!

Asher

well, in my mind anyway, some of them are more cheese looking than I hoped for :-D
 

Ken Tanaka

pro member
well, in my mind anyway, some of them are more cheese looking than I hoped for :-D

No, actually Daniel I think you did a pretty good job of creating a creepy scene. It's actually great fun to do. Here's one that I made five years ago, titled "Not As Alone As I Thought", mainly as a feminine frightener.

36123397.jpg


So I certainly know the experience.
 

james sperry

New member
hello again daniel,
do you remember my earlier comments? i went back and looked at the images on both of my monitors again and the darker images ( for me ) have a different feel to them. there are some loss of details in the cloak ( but w/ ps that can be brought back) and other parts of the image, but i love them in the darker monitor. with the darker monitor they also have a softer, dreamlike conveyance to them.

I just wanted to know if you looked at the images with a darker setting or exposure? there really is a dramatic difference. it emphasizes the theme of the images. just curious if you checked it out. lol .... sorry to keep bringing this thread back, i'm just stuck on it for some reason.

what gave you the inspiration for these images? were these shot digital or film? on your webpage the rusty pickup is also there, is there a story behind the pickup?
 

Daniel Buck

New member
hello again daniel,
do you remember my earlier comments? i went back and looked at the images on both of my monitors again and the darker images ( for me ) have a different feel to them. there are some loss of details in the cloak ( but w/ ps that can be brought back) and other parts of the image, but i love them in the darker monitor. with the darker monitor they also have a softer, dreamlike conveyance to them.

I just wanted to know if you looked at the images with a darker setting or exposure? there really is a dramatic difference. it emphasizes the theme of the images. just curious if you checked it out. lol .... sorry to keep bringing this thread back, i'm just stuck on it for some reason.

what gave you the inspiration for these images? were these shot digital or film? on your webpage the rusty pickup is also there, is there a story behind the pickup?

they could be made darker with no problem, there is plenty of shadow and highlight detail in the scans :) The ones that I printed, I darkened just the cloak, lowered the gamma on the overall image by just a touch.

They were shot on 8x10" Tri-x 320 and Arista 100 film.
 

james sperry

New member
No, actually Daniel I think you did a pretty good job of creating a creepy scene. It's actually great fun to do. Here's one that I made five years ago, titled "Not As Alone As I Thought", mainly as a feminine frightener.

36123397.jpg


So I certainly know the experience.

ken,
i like the use of verticle lines, perspective and the composition all together ( i like the one horizontal branch aslo ). well thought out.
 
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