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New Canon Camera, a legend?

Asher Kelman

OPF Owner/Editor-in-Chief
If a new 1Dseries (merged for sports and fashion) has increased DR and goes from 12 bit to 14 bit, I'll eat my hat, no matter the pixel count!

Asher
 

Sid Jervis

pro member
Asher Kelman said:
If a new 1Dseries (merged for sports and fashion) has increased DR and goes from 12 bit to 14 bit, I'll eat my hat, no matter the pixel count!

Asher
I don't think you will need to get the salt and pepper out :)
 

Tony Field

New member
Tom Henkel said:
The other factor about these specs that make me wonder is it sure sounds like a Canon version of the D2Xs. I always felt Canon would not do a crop-mode camera because it would legitimize Nikon's approach. If I was doing PR for Nikon (I do not, for the record), I might be inclined to declare that the balance of power in the pro DSLR market has shifted -- now Canon is chasing Nikon from a product innovation perspective. Whether that spin would stick is debatable, but it would be sure worth a try.

I doubt that Canon is concerned about "legitimizing Nikon". If so, they did that a long time ago when they eventually responded to the Nikon D1 CCD pro camera with the Canon 1D CCD pro camera. Similarly, with the TCP/IP wireless systems - and, I suspect, various minor details. I cannot see any reason other than patent problems to implement HSC if the pro community find it useful. If Canon did that, it would be with a "twist" that would allow them to truthfully make some "we are best" claims. Not only that, I am sure that Canon has long-ago considered high speed crop - it is an obvious technical construction.

Both camera systems are "leaders" in major ways. Nikon features have been improving steadily (with big gains in lenses with VR) and is now more commonly seen in in sports events where Canon has been dominant for years - at least that seems to be the case here in Calgary and on various sports programmes seen on TV such as the Tour de France, football, etc. (It seems as though sports is the only important measure of Cameras today :) Additionally, I have seen many Nikon systems in PJ situations on TV news - and Nikon has always been strong there.

No, I am not saying that Nikon is THE leader in all camera system components - it is just that too many Canon users become a bit smug with their toys and do not give credit where credit is due.
 

Don Lashier

New member
Alan T. Price said:
Well, as we now know, the 400D - a legend in their own mind.

LOL. I can't help but think that something else is coming. I recall a post several years ago at DPR by skin-flick photog in AU, Paul ? (can't remember his last name) who seemed closely connected with Canon who said that he had actually seen a proto by Canon of a high-DR camera that would be available in a couple years. Maybe that time has come.

- DL
 

Asher Kelman

OPF Owner/Editor-in-Chief
That Don, was Paul Pope.

He seemed to have a lot of fun doing his model shots. Has got the right predictions in the past. One guy from Australia had no respect for him. Others on Dpreview think he has a line direct to Canon. The idea is that Canon likes to test new cameras there.

He also shoots about 20 models a weeks with his Hassleblad H2D-39. He always sells some of his canon DSLR's 5 months before the new ones come out and he's doing that now.

Asher
 

Edmund Ronald

New member
Hey, folks, Paul Pope aside let's make sure we anonymize our sources properly before we burn them to a crisp.

I'm seriously thinking of moving to digital MF for the hi-quality stuff, selling the 1DsII, and using some random Canon eg. my battle scarred old 1Ds for the shows. The 1DsII and 1DII I owned were failures for people shoots although they were ok on things.

Edmund

Edmund
 

Asher Kelman

OPF Owner/Editor-in-Chief
Edmund Ronald said:
Hey, folks, Paul Pope aside let's make sure we anonymize our sources properly before we burn them to a crisp.

I'm seriously thinking of moving to digital MF for the hi-quality stuff, selling the 1DsII, and using some random Canon eg. my battle scarred old 1Ds for the shows. The 1DsII and 1DII I owned were failures for people shoots although they were ok on things.

Edmund

Edmund

Quite right Edmund about burning sources! I started toward possibly trespassing with that error months ago and thanks for correcting me then. No harm and a lesson leanred.

Here were only quotes directly from Paul's own posts.

He could just guess well. Well this time, how could he be far wrong. The odds are high, after all a for a new model soon.

My greetings to you and yours. I can see your grinning face in a Parisian cafe, and it's good. We'll come by again next year.

Asher
 

Don Lashier

New member
Asher Kelman said:
Here were only quotes directly from Paul's own posts.

And another PP quote - "The Canon EOS ONE ..... new body,new metering,flash and new non bayer sensor. " (not talking about this year).

When I bought my 1D I promised myself to not upgrade for 5 years. It's been hard (particularly the 5D) but I've managed. Ten months more to go - hopefully Paul's prediction will be true before I succomb.

- DL
 

Edmund Ronald

New member
Asher Kelman said:
Quite right Edmund about burning sources! I started toward possibly trespassing with that error months ago and thanks for correcting me then. No harm and a lesson leanred.

Here were only quotes directly from Paul's own posts.

He could just guess well. Well this time, how could he be far wrong. The odds are high, after all a for a new model soon.

My greetings to you and yours. I can see your grinning face in a Parisian cafe, and it's good. We'll come by again next year.

Asher

Always a pleasure to see you, Asher, provided you bring me some Sonoma Valley Red ;)

Re. The Canon I'll vote for the outsider: No new EOS1 for Photokina at least not deliverable this year; it's kind of strange, while I know a new model was expected and knew roughly what the specs were, I am not really feeling that it's getting out the door. Possibly some other model will be released , I think the 5D is such a huge success that we can expect some followup, because that hi-end amateur gear is where the real profit is these days and Canon will want to milk it.

Edmund
 

nicolas claris

OPF Co-founder/Administrator
customs and customs

Asher
Yes You may bring Sonoma wine in France.
But why?
When you come to France, I'm sure we'll all be happy, (as usual, may I say?) to welcome you with some Bordeaux 2003 or Burgundy as well...
Keep the very good Sonoma wine for when we come to visit you.
Don't forget that liquids are not anymore allowed in american airlines!

Last time we came to California we had a very memorable visit of Jack London's farm close to Sonoma Valley, and drunk some magnificient local wine at l'Auberge du Soleil …
 

Asher Kelman

OPF Owner/Editor-in-Chief
Why Nicolas? Because Edmund has eclectic taste!

I just assumed that Sonoma wines are a special treat hardly obtainable ever since California wines trumped, on several occaisions some high pedigree French wines in blind tasting by wine connoisseurs in Paris!

I'm not sure however, that they tested the magnificent Bordeaux wines we used to celebrate in our visit.

I do know that know Edmund has good taste!

Asher
 

Edmund Ronald

New member
Asher Kelman said:
Why Nicolas? Because Edmund has eclectic taste!

I just assumed that Sonoma wines are a special treat hardly obtainable ever since California wines trumped, on several occaisions some high pedigree French wines in blind tasting by wine connoisseurs in Paris!

I'm not sure however, that they tested the magnificent Bordeaux wines we used to celebrate in our visit.

I do know that know Edmund has good taste!

Asher

I've been impressed at the quality of the California reds, but what really astonishes me is some of the australian and chilean stuff. It would seem that some of the French houses have set up shop overseas.

Anyway, I'd be delighted to drink some Freedom Wine - and just as delighted to see you ;)


Edmund

PS what's your bet in the EOS-1 sweeps ?
 

RoyVarley

New member
Edmund Ronald said:
but what really astonishes me is some of the australian and chilean stuff. It would seem that some of the French houses have set up shop overseas.

Careful there, Edmund. We grow our own grapes AND expertise. ;) Much like the Californians we are beating the French at their own game.

But you're right, some French companies have bought into Australian concerns - recognition of the quality, no? :D
 

Asher Kelman

OPF Owner/Editor-in-Chief
Roy,

The Australian vintners should be glad they are far from Chile! We have convoys of massive tanker trucks with the crushed juice of Chilean Grapes that make there way to the USA for the USA market! That stuff is apparently great quality. It ends up in wines, fruit juices and might put a marginal vineyard out of business! A road to Chile would be very bad!

Asher
 

nicolas claris

OPF Co-founder/Administrator
Tss Tss Tss

Asher, You forgot one of the OPF rules we've set up in Bordeaux with your last visit...
- It is the one who travels who is invited by his host...
Then the one who wishes to taste the already quailifed as *magnificient* wine from Sonoma, got to travel to California!
Remember I still plan to come in November, get your glasses ready! <he said with a large smile>

Asher Kelman said:
Why Nicolas? Because Edmund has eclectic taste!

I just assumed that Sonoma wines are a special treat hardly obtainable ever since California wines trumped, on several occaisions some high pedigree French wines in blind tasting by wine connoisseurs in Paris!

I'm not sure however, that they tested the magnificent Bordeaux wines we used to celebrate in our visit.

I do know that know Edmund has good taste!

Asher
 

Asher Kelman

OPF Owner/Editor-in-Chief
Nicolas,

We'll do you proud. Although you must give me exact dates so I can arrange things! Maybe you'll be able to shoot with us too.

There is an adequate supply of wines here. No we we can drink even half of it! Great French visitors bring at least one 1DsII as a token that the French do indeed appreciate the American's sacrifices in two great wars! We will have an official toasting ceremony and the French consul and his stunningly beautiful young, so young wife, will be invited to be the guests of honor.

Asher
 

Edmund Ronald

New member
Asher Kelman said:
Nicolas,

We'll do you proud. Although you must give me exact dates so I can arrange things! Maybe you'll be able to shoot with us too.

There is an adequate supply of wines here. No we we can drink even half of it! Great French visitors bring at least one 1DsII as a token that the French do indeed appreciate the American's sacrifices in two great wars! We will have an official toasting ceremony and the French consul and his stunningly beautiful young, so young wife, will be invited to be the guests of honor.

Asher

"I always worry about being served for lunch" said the ambassador when he was showed the freedom-sized cooking facilities ;)

Edmund
 

Don Lashier

New member
Edmund Ronald said:
"I always worry about being served for lunch" said the ambassador when he was showed the freedom-sized cooking facilities ;)

Edmund

Maybe he should worry about being toasted ;)

- DL
 

Asher Kelman

OPF Owner/Editor-in-Chief
Back to topic, Edmund, have you heard anything about a new 1D series camera, excluding from me) that you could share:

a. Nope, not heard anything!
b.Yes and I can share :)
c. Yes, but unfortunately, I can't share W.O. burning some NDA of someone in know. :(

Asher
 

Edmund Ronald

New member
Asher,

Asher, I do not like questionnaires.

Here is my belief about the state of play. All information *as of writing* taken from the net.

Although various prototypes exist, I believe there has been a schedule delay and the new EOS-1 series digital is not yet *in production*, and indeed with the delay there are conflicts with the coming high end prosumer cameras and so the final specs may even not be fully nailed down. Yet.

Now of course if Canon starts delivering end September / beginning October I will be shown to be wrong, if they just make an announcement and show a prototype at Photokina it means that at that point they have decided which features (sensor and cleaning in particular) they will integrate in the version they deliver.

Edmund

If I change my mind I may tell you.
Asher Kelman said:
Back to topic, Edmund, have you heard anything about a new 1D series camera, excluding from me) that you could share:

a. Nope, not heard anything!
b.Yes and I can share :)
c. Yes, but unfortunately, I can't share W.O. burning some NDA of someone in know. :(

Asher
 

Don Lashier

New member
> I do not like QCMs

MCQs to us yanks, but I see you clarified that.

There must always be a last choice: d) none of the above

- DL
 

Asher Kelman

OPF Owner/Editor-in-Chief
That's pretty good information and probably the best summary on the web given all I know or believe I know!

Thanks Edmund,

and Don, "none of the above" would not have been of interest to me.

Asher
 

Nathan Caulford

New member
My Guess: 24 MP/ 8 fps, Digic 3, vibration dust control, 2.5" LCD

ON NIKON: Poor Nikon, indeed. Nikon has to merge with a super power, and even then it is doubful that they will survive because of the Canon onslaught. Canon is a monster of a company in comparison, they manufacture all their own lenses, bodies, sensors, processors, etc... and they invest incredible sums of money into R&D every year. They hold the world record for quantity of lenses manufactured. And they have enough stuff in the pipeline to easily bury Nikon. It is doubtful that Canon will soon if ever incorporate 3-color sensors in their cameras. Look at the new Hasselblad H2X-39: 39 MP, 1 layer. Others as well.

ON 1-SERIES: I heard from a source at Canon a year ago that they would do away with the 2 different 1-series bodies, and opt for a high-megapixel, high frame rate single 1-series camera. If they do go to one body, It'll have to do 8 fps, it's the standard in sports and photojournalism. They'd piss off a lot of users to take that speed away.

As far as a release date, they are overdue given historical trend as of Jun-July.

On wine: It seems camera connoisseurs are usually wine connoisseurs as well. Chilean grapes are awesome, I lived in the Chilean wine region for about 18 months. They have grapes roughly the size of apricots (no exhageration) and tasty too. AND they are the biggest exporter to the U.S. of grapes. One of my favorites is the inexpensive ($10US/bottle) 2005 Veramonte Sauvignon Blanc. Fizzy, with a wide range of fruit on the palate and it's great with crab legs.

Enjoy.
 

Asher Kelman

OPF Owner/Editor-in-Chief
Nathan Caulford said:
My Guess: 24 MP/ 8 fps, Digic 3, vibration dust control, 2.5" LCD

ON NIKON: Poor Nikon, indeed. Nikon has to merge with a super power, and even then it is doubtful that they will survive because of the Canon onslaught.
Don't count them out! The will no doubt be working on a larger chip from another company. For a chip MFR, Nikon is a better bet than some MF camera companies.

Anyway, we need to help support Nikon, if only get Canon to deliver the 3-layer sensor they have!

Thank goodness, Sony is chewing up market share at the lower end, hence the incredible XTi, which really is a 30D in a bargain package. Buy a lens that is at least f 2.8 and the very good central focus point whips into action. So this with an inexpensive 50 1.8mm is a great portrait lens for a song!

I thank Sony for that.

If Nikon would do better in the 8fps range, we would have better Sports and action cameras overnight. Canon doesn't have to design them, they just have to open a cupboard and say guys, here, let's get out this 10fps 10MP 12BIT camera with BINNING ISO, grainless to 6,400 and we want this in the stores in 3 months, go do it!

Now Canon doesn't even have to open that cupboard!

So we need Nikon to give competition. We might have to wait for Sony to creep upward in their market erosion strategies to get Canon to accelerate their release of the newest technologies, which they know they have to sell at the same price or lower than current models!

Nathan Caulford said:
It is doubtful that Canon will soon if ever incorporate 3-color sensors in their cameras. Look at the new Hasselblad H2X-39: 39 MP, 1 layer. Others as well.

A 3-layer chip will allow Canon to offer much higher resolution and faster frame rates at low cost, since they have mastered inexpensive CMOS production techniques. The chips are already designed. They are sure merely doing the integration to get the massive data off the chip and processed. The new chips will offer so much more that photography will be revolutionized entirely. One such chip could lead to sales just of firmware to keep the camera amazing us for the next ten years.

Nathan Caulford said:
ON 1-SERIES: I heard from a source at Canon a year ago that they would do away with the 2 different 1-series bodies, and opt for a high-megapixel, high frame rate single 1-series camera. If they do go to one body, It'll have to do 8 fps; it's the standard in sports and photojournalism. They'd piss off a lot of users to take that speed away.

Don't worry for a second. You don't need two models when you have a 24MP camera with BINNING so that it would do 4 frames per second at 24 MP and 8 frames per second, at your choice, at 8MP. Binning combines adjacent pixels and means less processing and higher ISO.

I don't think the 3 layer CMOS is due for 2 years. However, when it does, someone will buy Foveon, for sure!

Nathan Caulford said:
On wine: It seems camera connoisseurs are usually wine connoisseurs as well.
Interesting observation! I think it's either that or an amazing bond with a myriad of pets!

Anyway, this month or in spring we'll say goodbye to the current DSLR's royalty, "The king is dead! Long live the king!"

Asher
 

Edmund Ronald

New member
Hmm a lot of the future of the indicative here, indicating precisely nothing.
I think tomorrow I'll try and take some pictures; my old camera still seems to work ;)

Edmund
 
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