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Which color space do you print from?

Jon Mark

New member
sRGB or Adobe RGB? I've always printed from Adobe RGB, but I notice that many online photoprinters request sRBG color space -- Mpix and whcc to name a few. I am confused. Can anyone shed some light on this question?

Thanks in advance.
 

Dierk Haasis

pro member
Whatever the image is tagged with - unless it is not tagged, then I use AdobeRGB.

Most of the time I now embed ProPhotoRGB, mostly because forgotten conversion are obvious [try looking at a ProPhoto image in a browser or non-cm'ed application].
 

Asher Kelman

OPF Owner/Editor-in-Chief
Hi Rodney,

We are so fortunate to have to here to answer such an important question.

As you point out there is no simple fix and set and leave is inappropriate for full use of the choices of color spaces.

However, Jon, here, are the simple points to prepare you for this well written article, (great for the novice to advanced professional):

There are color spaces for the scene, the capture device, (the monitor: don't use that, it is a WINDOW to you image, not the image) and the pronter. Each color space occupies a different volume in the 3D represnetation of the combinations of 3 componants of color:

HUE (ie how much cyan, magenta and yellow or other color is in that part of the scene.) BRIGHTNESS , SATURATION (How much color is there. Is it a very pale red or intense).

BIT DEPTH: can be 8 BIT or 16 BIT. If you have an image which you process in 8 BIT, you may be losing intermediate colors, (tones and hues) and inadvertantly posterize your image to some extent. Work in 16BIT all the way through.

SIZE OF COLOUR SPACE:Think of volume, not a 2D page. Ther latter gives only one view of the 3D true distribution of contained colors. Use of a wider RGB color space in the capture of an image (camera or scanner) may not be needed, however, for a start, as you get going, that is a good advice.

Use Adobe RGB or Profoto RGB for now as these lose less original data. You may get a better monitor eventually to see them one day and a printer that can deliver these colors in a print.

At present, some printers can deliver colors, especially Epson's blue and green, that cannot be seen on your monitor. However, the Adobe software is very smart and will REMAP the colors to create a perception of a great picture in spite of assigning slightly different colors. Remember, the monitor is merely a viewing port, just like a hole in the fence of a construction site.

Don't switch back and forth between color spaces as EACH TIME to are likely doing some clipping.

As a start, just for now, only convert to sRGB for posting on the web or if you KNOW the image has limited muted colors or you are sending it to a friend who only uses sRGB and cannot fathom an color ideas. You shouldn't use a printer who insists on sRGB.

Costco uses calibrated color managed printers and will take a wide file. You probably will be delighted by their printing!

Although the Epson, Canon and HP printers work within CMYK color paradigms, they are RGB printers in that the input is assumed to be your RGB files. So don't convert to CMYK before printing. Instead, you can get an idea of what it might look at what this might apear in print by using VIEW, then choosing "working CMYK" in the Photoshop top menu bar.

If you have read up to here, now read the PDF article.

Asher
 
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Jon Mark

New member
Thanks for the pdf Andrew! Asher...this forum is a great place to learn and improve technique. Nice job of putting this together.

I need to do more reading and experimenting. Thanks for all the advice!
 

Ben Rubinstein

pro member
I would disagree with Asher, all Fuji frontiers use an sRGB like profile and do not convert for printing! There are many pro labs using frontiers infact Costco is in the minority in that they use Noritsu's. If you are sending files to any fuji lab then my personal advice is to convert and work with sRGB (keeping the original RAW file of course for the future). Working with a wider space and converting down for print can be more hassle than it is worth.
 

Andrew Rodney

New member
Ben Rubinstein said:
I would disagree with Asher, all Fuji frontiers use an sRGB like profile and do not convert for printing!.

Not so! It all depends on the front end driving the Frontier. Those using the PIC Pro package can fully utilize ICC profiles for output.

In addition, the Frontier does NOT output sRGB (there's only one device that can do this, it's a CRT display in a very specific state and ambient environment). It is IMPOSSIBLE for a Frontier to output sRGB. It can assume all files are in sRGB for an internal, on the fly conversion to it's native output color space. Or as I said, it can be setup to be fully color managed. All depends on it's setup.
 

Asher Kelman

OPF Owner/Editor-in-Chief
Everyone,

This is, of course, a non-commercial website. We have, at present, no commercial "connections" or income, still we like to see moderators get known. Every word that Andrew writes is usesful.

If you go to the new Photographic Training Seminars and Travel Forum you will see we just have started with Alain Briot's offerings.

Occaisionally I'll try to put in a plug for the teaching of various professionals. Please go the the Digital Dog website. Andrew Rodney is one of the foremost educators on color management and is worth putting on you "to do list" for improvement of your color workflow.

If I have been to one of the seminars, read the book or gone through the teaching CD carefully, I'll also try to review it for you.

So for now, just go to Andrew Rodneys website and see what interests you. At the very least, he has a wealth of free information that will be helpful.


Asher
 

Don Lashier

New member
I'm surprised that no one has mentioned Ethan Hansen's profile database for lab printers, including Walmart Fujis and Costo Noritsus. In this case you convert to the printer profile then specifiy no adjustment.

- DL
 
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