Pricing Fine Art Photography for Gallery etc.

[Vincent Valle]

Hi Everyone-
Very happy to have found such a nicely run forum. I Wanted to reach out to any artistic photographers who sell their work matted and framed. I've been marketing my work slowly and I am in front of three opportunities that I'm going forward with, one with a gallery and two within fine establishments in town. I really need some help with pricing. I know I have to break down my printing, frame molding, matting, glass etc. Since I frame them myself, do I need to figure in the cost of framing (based on what a frame shop would charge?-I have the means to calculate that). The part that is also difficult for me is what to charge for the Artistic side of it. My work is 16x20 prints, framed in aprox 3-5 inch frame with 3-4 inch mat.

I really appreciate any help. I have researched this topic to death. (I tried using the "cost of doing business calculator" but it was not helpful. I'd like to be able to develop a pricing plan for : framed and matted and just digital images.

I'm an internet researcher by day and I tried finding info here and abroad and have found little of anything that would help.

thanks very much
Vince

[Asher Kelman]

Hi Vincent,

Glad you found us! Great that you already have good possibilites for selling your work and congratulations for being able to print and frame in house.

I think you might start by looking at the prices charged by people who earn their bread and butter and even Porches by selling hteir work.

One guy who has done well for himself is Alain Briot. He has a very well organised website which establishes him as an expert and getting a photograph a privilige as he gives an aura of care, quality, passion and artistry. He is driven to being a good marketer and that model obvviously works fvor him. However, you are not Elvis not are you Alain. his pictures are worth what he charges to his own audience which would likely not be yours.

You may very well have a picture not as good as any of his and sell it for far more than he could get or else you might have an astonishngly perfect and original B&W print of the Grand Canyon that you cannot get anyone sto spend $100 on.

Still look at his website and the prices of his work.

This is a good topic. I'll try to get some references for you and maybe you could extend that and we could write a report on the price trends, with the caveat, that each guys capability, originality, built up following and marketability is individual. Also just because prices are given, does not mean that that guy sell anything!

If you post some examples of you work it might help me look for "similar" segments of the market. This is, you know a very tough thing, but a necessary part of marketing you work.

Thanks for joining and raising this important question.

Welcome,

Asher

Do you have a gallery to share?

[Nicolas Claris]

Originally Posted by Asher Kelman

Do you have a gallery to share?

http://www.vincentvalle.com/

;-)

[Asher Kelman]

Hi Vincent,

I enjoyed visiting your gallery. I can see your pictures selling well.

Asher

[Mike Bailey]

Vince,

Sometimes the obvious isn't obvious - well, for me anyhow. As I come from an art fair background, I'd say a good place to get an idea on pricing for prints alone and for framed prints is to walk through a few art fairs. There's always one going on somewhere nearby, and this time of the year in Florida there should be some near you. There'll be a wide range of prices and quality, and that depends on what the art fair itself juries in, but you can sort some of that out by observing the quality of the work, both in the art and in the framing, and place yourself where you think you should fit. At least this way you'll be sure to get actual prices being charged by actual artists. Via the internet/verbal, it's very hard to access the validity of just about any statement(s).

As for matting and framing, doing it yourself can be used as a value-added element for pricing and selling, i.e. don't price as high as a professional framer/gallery would charge, but enough to cover your cost of goods and what you think your own time is worth right now: minimum wage $10/hr, a bit better at $20 an hour, etc. One needs to be honest with oneself when looking at the quality of the matting and framing, too. If it looks completely professional, then you can charge more, but keeping in mind it can be a good tool for helping the sale along.

Pricing on digital files is maybe the hardest since you need to keep as many rights as possible when selling use (one-time non-exclusive is a good starting point) of the file and then price according to where the file is going. Since you did a lot of research already, you probably know there's a vast amount of data out there on this subject. Of course by the time you start selling prints you should already have registered all of your images with the U.S. Copyright Office, which is another story.

Mike

[John_Nevill]

Vincent,

Putting a price on one's images is extremely difficult,

If your starting out, then commanding higher prices may conflict with your ability to generate sales. However......

I also sell at craft fairs and Mike's suggestion is extremely valid.

A friend of mine, who's been marketing his images for about the same time as me (4 years), sells his prints ~50% higher than my pricing.

We both do ~3 largish craft fairs a year and we end up turning over the same amount of money, although as you can guess, I shift 50% more stock.

Website sales last year, for me, have been extremely poor, and likewise its been the same for a number of other photographers I know.

I've tried various costing models and one the one that seems to work at craft fairs, is to set your pricing to recover all your stock outlay through ~20% of your sales.

For web site sales, it's a different ball game, customers (excluding friends and family) who come across your images are normally looking for something specific and hence are more likely to pay a reasonable / realistic price.

Again, research other "less known" photographers websites and see what they are selling for, in general terms most print prices are in the same ball park.

Once you have built a reputation, then your work will flourish and prices can be revised, although this will take time.

Another option to consider is stock agencies, although they pretty much dictate the pricing and commission for new entrants.

One thing to bear in mind, if you are relatively new to the arena, is once you have set your prices, its easier to lower than to raise them. So be realistic, I work on 300% material mark-up, so a 16x20" mounted print cost me ~£8 ($16) to produce, I'll intially sell it for £25 ($50) on the web and £20 ($40) at the craft fair. Many people say they are too cheap, but in contrast I aint shifting volumes so YMMV.

At the end of the day its about how much faith you have in your work and whether the market wants it. I know many pro, semi pro and amateur photographers in the UK, none really make real money off fine art print sales and most end up selling to stock agencies for bread and butter income.

So to make prints sales work, I believe one needs to exploit niche markets with original and stylised image content.

Hope this helps!

[Asher Kelman]

Hi Vincent you already have the valuable experience shared by both John & Mike,

I agree with the craft fair approach to gauge price points. However, I'd find away to clearly separate these from those you want to be sold at a gallery. You could have two names, for example sign by you first name or first and middle name only at the fair.

However, being represented in a real art gallery is another matter. They want to sell your work for as much as possible and may not like your work to be available for 1/3 or 1/10 of the price. It could be that that 16x20 should go for $1,600 and the store will give you from 40% to 50%. You might choose a trade name like Prince or Madonna, (those names are taken, ) but you should not undermine your Art Gallery price points, unless in a private sale. This is a serious business and getting a gallery to represent you can be a major advantage. OTOH, the gallery better have customers or you are backed into a corner.

It could be that only certain sizes are sold at the gallery. Just think about why a gallery should work to sell your photographs when they learn that people can simply get them for a small fraction of the price at the Art Fair.

If you want to make a living on selling your work, get a marketer to help you. What is the demographic of the people who might buy your work? Do you have a mailing list of those who already purchased your work? Do you send them cards?

I think you have already a leg up on the competition by have sources for sale. If those are professional clients, then get the best professional advice. If the gallery is professional and not a restaurant that also hands and sell artwork, the owner will help you set the price according to his/her best instincts. That is often a fair guide, but take a few opinions.

Good luck, of course, tell us how this works out and how finally you set your prices.

Asher

[Kathy Rappaport]

Thank you for this thread. I got my keys today for my studio and gallery. While I am aiming to shoot people, product and events, the other photography that I have done, I hope to sell - at more than Craft fair prices but there are a number of good ideas! Thanks for posting them. So much to think about.

[John_Nevill]

Asher, you make some valid points.

I've yet to explore galleries, perhaps its too early for me, or being little less than confident.

Anyhow, strolling through a couple of smaller london galleries last month, proves you were pretty spot on for pricing.

Getting your work exhibited in print form is good step in the right direction. There's something tactile about a quality print that people relate to.

My wife's friend did a belated documentary style photo exhibition of "Ghost ships of the Falklands" last month at an art centre and he sold quite few prints (although under commission). Something definitely worth thinking about, but equally there's craft fairs and there's craft fairs.

Kath, your studio will be a great outlet, i'm almost jealous , seriously though what more could you ask, extensive wall space to mix'n'match your own work , I wish you every success!

[Vincent Valle]

WOW! I cannot believe how much amazing information has been shared here since I posted my original question almost 5 years ago. I really admire all the input and honesty. I have a lot more reading to do!

I've made some progress over the past 5 years... and due to certain life events, I've begun to put myself out there. Thanks to all the feedback and support, I've been selling my work, entering Juried events in Naples and have just put my work in a shop near me. I've begun to reach out to galleries as I start developing some artistic series. I even have some work in a restaurant here. Bottom line is that I have started enjoying it instead of worrying about what might or might not happen.

I updated my website recently and continue to tweek it. I'd be honored if you all would take a look.

With regard to my topic on pricing...once I moved to Naples, I discovered some great art shows down here. I took my little note pad and went to each of the shows and took note of the type of work, framing method, size, etc. I then priced my work accordingly.

Vince

[Bart_van_der_Wolf]

Hi Vince,

Congratulations on the progress.

Cheers,
Bart