Open Photography Forums  
HOME FORUMS NEWS FAQ SEARCH

Go Back   Open Photography Forums > Digital Darkroom > Image Processing and Workflow

Image Processing and Workflow RAW, DNG , TIFF and JPG. From Capture to Ready for Publish/Display. All software and techniques used within an image workflow, (except extensive retouching and repair or DAM).

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
  #1  
Old June 25th, 2010, 10:20 AM
Doug Kerr Doug Kerr is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: May 2006
Location: Alamogordo, New Mexico, USA
Posts: 8,505
Default Simulating a photograph

Is there a Photoshop function we can use to take an image that looks like a highly-realistic painting and transform it so it looks more like a photograph?

Best regards,

Doug
Reply With Quote
  #2  
Old June 25th, 2010, 11:16 AM
Asher Kelman Asher Kelman is online now
OPF Owner/Editor-in-Chief
 
Join Date: Apr 2006
Posts: 34,522
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Doug Kerr View Post
Is there a Photoshop function we can use to take an image that looks like a highly-realistic painting and transform it so it looks more like a photograph?
This would be a fun challenge! Every painting has it's own character so I assume you are starting with a photorealistic picture. The things to get rid of would be the canvas texture by some sort of descreening method and the brush strokes.

Asher
__________________
Follow us on Twitter at @opfweb

Our purpose is getting to an impressive photograph. So we encourage browsing and then feedback. Consider a link to your galleries annotated, C&C welcomed. Images posted within OPF are assumed to be for Comment & Critique, unless otherwise designated.
Reply With Quote
  #3  
Old June 25th, 2010, 11:23 AM
StuartRae StuartRae is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: Wiltshire, UK
Posts: 1,025
Default

Hi Doug,

Easier said than done I suspect. Do you have an example of what you have in mind?

Regards,

Stuart
__________________
-----------------------------------
C&C and edits always welcome
Reply With Quote
  #4  
Old June 25th, 2010, 12:31 PM
Doug Kerr Doug Kerr is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: May 2006
Location: Alamogordo, New Mexico, USA
Posts: 8,505
Default

Hi, Stuart,

Quote:
Originally Posted by StuartRae View Post
Hi Doug,

Easier said than done I suspect.
Indeed. But they were photographs once, so maybe the transformation is reversible.

Quote:
Do you have an example of what you have in mind?
Well, here is a recent offering from Matt Halstead:


Best regards,

Doug
Reply With Quote
  #5  
Old June 25th, 2010, 12:43 PM
Bart_van_der_Wolf Bart_van_der_Wolf is offline
pro member
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: Netherlands
Posts: 4,054
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Doug Kerr View Post
Is there a Photoshop function we can use to take an image that looks like a highly-realistic painting and transform it so it looks more like a photograph?
Hi Doug,

Not Photoshop necessarily, although there are some free PS plug-ins available. Depending on the structure of the paint and canvas, you could probably hide some structure by a Fourier transform, edit out the repetitive structures, and inverse Fourier transform. Whether that helps, depends on the image at hand.

Perhaps easier to do/try with "ImageJ" which has higher accuracy Fourier transforms than the 8-b/ch plugins for Photoshop, and is available for all OS platforms because it's a Java program. The transforms are to be applied on the individual R/G/B channels and then recombined int RGB. You can test with only the green channel to see if it helps enough.

Otherwise you may want to blur the image of the painting and resharpen somewhat if possible. You can try using deconvolution sharpening with "RawTherapee", a free Rawconverter which also allows to open Tiffs and apply Richardson Lucy sharpening on them. As said, it depends on the image at hand how successful that will be.

Cheers,
Bart

P.S. On the other hand if you were being a bit sarcastic and/or a real painting was not the origin, then Fourier transforms are not what you need ...
Reply With Quote
  #6  
Old June 25th, 2010, 01:44 PM
Doug Kerr Doug Kerr is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: May 2006
Location: Alamogordo, New Mexico, USA
Posts: 8,505
Default

Hi, Bart,

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bart_van_der_Wolf View Post
On the other hand if you were being a bit sarcastic and/or a real painting was not the origin, then Fourier transforms are not what you need.
Yeah, I was.

Probably the function I'm looking for is "undo"!

Thanks.

Best regards,

Doug
Reply With Quote
  #7  
Old June 25th, 2010, 01:49 PM
StuartRae StuartRae is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: Wiltshire, UK
Posts: 1,025
Default

Quote:
Yeah, I was.

Probably the function I'm looking for is "undo"!
Well, that saves me from making the reply I spent an hour thinking about.

Regards,

Stuart
__________________
-----------------------------------
C&C and edits always welcome
Reply With Quote
  #8  
Old June 25th, 2010, 02:16 PM
Asher Kelman Asher Kelman is online now
OPF Owner/Editor-in-Chief
 
Join Date: Apr 2006
Posts: 34,522
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Doug Kerr View Post
Is there a Photoshop function we can use to take an image that looks like a highly-realistic painting and transform it so it looks more like a photograph?
I'd love to know what you are really talking about! Show us the picture which made you think along this track! Is there anything besides Matt's picture that got you going here?

Asher
__________________
Follow us on Twitter at @opfweb

Our purpose is getting to an impressive photograph. So we encourage browsing and then feedback. Consider a link to your galleries annotated, C&C welcomed. Images posted within OPF are assumed to be for Comment & Critique, unless otherwise designated.
Reply With Quote
  #9  
Old June 25th, 2010, 08:12 PM
Doug Kerr Doug Kerr is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: May 2006
Location: Alamogordo, New Mexico, USA
Posts: 8,505
Default

Hi, Asher,

Quote:
Originally Posted by Asher Kelman View Post
I'd love to know what you are really talking about! Show us the picture which made you think along this track! Is there anything besides Matt's picture that got you going here?
I see these things here all the time of late, images that have been so heavily "tone-mapped" that they look like highly realistic paintings.

Best regards,

Doug
Reply With Quote
  #10  
Old June 25th, 2010, 09:50 PM
Asher Kelman Asher Kelman is online now
OPF Owner/Editor-in-Chief
 
Join Date: Apr 2006
Posts: 34,522
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Doug Kerr View Post
Hi, Asher,


I see these things here all the time of late, images that have been so heavily "tone-mapped" that they look like highly realistic paintings.
So what is genuine nowadays? Genuine Nagahyde or genuine "fake" watches. For the latter, the guy, (in the underground market in Istanbul with that sign), must have thought that Fake was brand like Nike!

Asher
__________________
Follow us on Twitter at @opfweb

Our purpose is getting to an impressive photograph. So we encourage browsing and then feedback. Consider a link to your galleries annotated, C&C welcomed. Images posted within OPF are assumed to be for Comment & Critique, unless otherwise designated.
Reply With Quote
  #11  
Old June 25th, 2010, 10:47 PM
Ken Tanaka Ken Tanaka is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: USA
Posts: 1,300
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Doug Kerr View Post
Is there a Photoshop function we can use to take an image that looks like a highly-realistic painting and transform it so it looks more like a photograph?

Best regards,

Doug
Several contemporary art photographers produce imagery that might be characterized as such. German photographer Loretta Lux comes immediately to mind as an example.
__________________
- Ken Tanaka -
Reply With Quote
  #12  
Old June 26th, 2010, 05:56 AM
Doug Kerr Doug Kerr is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: May 2006
Location: Alamogordo, New Mexico, USA
Posts: 8,505
Default

Hi, Asher,

Quote:
Originally Posted by Asher Kelman View Post
So what is genuine nowadays? Genuine Nagahyde or genuine "fake" watches. For the latter, the guy, (in the underground market in Istanbul with that sign), must have thought that Fake was brand like Nike!
Many years ago, in Las Vegas, while I was attending a standards meeting (well, they had to be held someplace!), a colleague returned from lunch excited at having been able to buy, very cheap, a famous-brand (for then) wrist watch. I looked at its face. Sure enough, there was the manufacturer's name: Hawilton.

As to genuine, every image is genuine - it is really that image.

Best regards,

Doug
Reply With Quote
  #13  
Old June 26th, 2010, 06:04 AM
Doug Kerr Doug Kerr is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: May 2006
Location: Alamogordo, New Mexico, USA
Posts: 8,505
Default

Hi, Ken,

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ken Tanaka View Post
Several contemporary art photographers produce imagery that might be characterized as such. German photographer Loretta Lux comes immediately to mind as an example.
Thanks for that link. The work is lovely.

I note that, in contrast to the work to which my comment originally related, her work does not exhibit "extreme" saturation. The properties that make her images appear much like highly-realistic illustrations are are more subtle (I'm not sure that I could quickly characterize them).

Her images also do not make me itch to find the "undo" button.

Best regards,

Doug
Reply With Quote
  #14  
Old June 29th, 2010, 01:22 PM
Alain Briot Alain Briot is offline
pro member
 
Join Date: May 2006
Location: Phoenix, Arizona, USA
Posts: 1,423
Default

to simulate a photograph one could just take a photograph... what a concept!

Why start with a painting? Why not just take a photo of the scene you painted?
__________________
Alain Briot
Fine Art, workshops, books: Get 40 Free eBooks when you subscribe to my newsletter:
http://www.beautiful-landscape.com
Reply With Quote
  #15  
Old June 29th, 2010, 01:41 PM
Doug Kerr Doug Kerr is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: May 2006
Location: Alamogordo, New Mexico, USA
Posts: 8,505
Default

Hi, Alain,

Quote:
Originally Posted by Alain Briot View Post
to simulate a photograph one could just take a photograph... what a concept!

Why start with a painting? Why not just take a photo of the scene you painted?
I have to apologize for having started this wild goose chase as a matter of irony.

I had been concerned that many images submitted here, actual photographs, had been so severely "tonemapped" that I would sarcastically say, "that almost looks like a photograph".

It was just one more step in my irony to ask whether there was a way that these could be made to look like actual (that is to say, "normal") photographs.

Best regards,

Doug
Reply With Quote
  #16  
Old June 29th, 2010, 01:56 PM
Mark Hampton Mark Hampton is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: May 2010
Posts: 1,330
Default

lets pop in the negative hand paintings - that are now photographic positives !!

http://nochesenblanco.files.wordpres...-p2210651b.jpg

not my image but follow the linky
Reply With Quote
  #17  
Old June 29th, 2010, 05:00 PM
Alain Briot Alain Briot is offline
pro member
 
Join Date: May 2006
Location: Phoenix, Arizona, USA
Posts: 1,423
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Doug Kerr View Post
Hi, Alain,


I have to apologize for having started this wild goose chase as a matter of irony.

I had been concerned that many images submitted here, actual photographs, had been so severely "tonemapped" that I would sarcastically say, "that almost looks like a photograph".

It was just one more step in my irony to ask whether there was a way that these could be made to look like actual (that is to say, "normal") photographs.

Best regards,

Doug
I did understand it as irony. But the whole point of making a photo look like a painting is that a painting is time consuming to create. A photo is not, at least not in the capture sense of it. Plus, "painting filters" were made for photographers, or for people who start with a photo and want "something else". People who have paintings don't care to turn them into photos!!!
__________________
Alain Briot
Fine Art, workshops, books: Get 40 Free eBooks when you subscribe to my newsletter:
http://www.beautiful-landscape.com
Reply With Quote
  #18  
Old June 29th, 2010, 07:50 PM
Asher Kelman Asher Kelman is online now
OPF Owner/Editor-in-Chief
 
Join Date: Apr 2006
Posts: 34,522
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Alain Briot View Post
I did understand it as irony. But the whole point of making a photo look like a painting is that a painting is time consuming to create.
Thanks Alain! It also takes technique, devotion, patience and still he ability to express imagination!

Quote:
Originally Posted by Alain Briot View Post
A photo is not, at least not in the capture sense of it [a painting]. Plus, "painting filters" were made for photographers, or for people who start with a photo and want "something else". People who have paintings don't care to turn them into photos!!!
Yes, they "start with a photograph and then want to turn it into something else". What they want to do is to pass as being as creative and skilled as a painter is.

Asher


For those who want to follow the other side of the discussion, that the darkroom photographer, Maris initiated, whether or not digital imaging is truly photography too, is presented separately here.
__________________
Follow us on Twitter at @opfweb

Our purpose is getting to an impressive photograph. So we encourage browsing and then feedback. Consider a link to your galleries annotated, C&C welcomed. Images posted within OPF are assumed to be for Comment & Critique, unless otherwise designated.
Reply With Quote
Reply

Bookmarks

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are Off
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Critique Desired: Flooded Field Tom Robbins Landscape - Travel 20 November 4th, 2009 11:22 PM
Authorship? Whose Work is it when the photograph gets copied in someway or other? Asher Kelman Layback Cafe 0 July 13th, 2009 03:42 PM
Picture within a photograph: But who's art is it? Asher Kelman Still Photo: Approaching Fine Photography 27 December 19th, 2008 03:55 PM


All times are GMT -7. The time now is 12:28 PM.


Posting images or text grants license to OPF, yet of such remain with its creator. Still, all assembled discussion 2006-2017 Asher Kelman (all rights reserved) Posts with new theme or unusual image might be moved/copied to a new thread!