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  • Welcome to the new site. Here's a thread about the update where you can post your feedback, ask questions or spot those nasty bugs!

Telephoto "reach"

Doug Kerr

Well-known member
Today I will discuss an issue that is often misunderstood by "newcomers" to "advanced photography". Experienced photographers are aware of it, but may not have a clear idea of the principles behind it, and thus may not be able to clearly articulate it to others.

Suppose I have a very nice lens with a focal length of 100mm. For a certain task, I say I wish I had a 200 mm lens. What would the advantage be?

Well a civilian might say, "Well, that way you can take a picture of something farther away."

Well, of course, that's not it. My 35 mm lens will let me take a picture of the moon, about 250,000 miles away.

We "advanced photographers" recognize that in fact the purpose is really to have the desired subject region fill more of the frame. But why is that advantageous?

After all, if we take a picture of a bear with a 200 mm lens, and want only the bear (and a certain amount of surround) in the "delivered" image (perhaps a print), we crop to suit. If we took the shot from the same location with a 100 mm lens, we can deliver an image with the same "framing". We just "crop more tightly". So why buy a longer focal length lens?

But, if in fact, the resolution of the entire camera (lens plus sensor and image processing system), at the focal plane, is the same in either case, then the image with the 200 mm lens will be better resolved ("sharper").

If the resolution is 100 line pairs per millimeter, and the bear's length, in the 100 mm shot, occupies 5 mm on the sensor, and in the 200 mm shot, occupies 10 mm, then:

• In the 100 mm shot, the bear (longitudinally) has the benefit of 500 lines of resolution
•In the 200 mm shot, the bear has the benefit of 1000 lines of resolution

Thus clearly, especially if we crop the two frames so the "delivered print" shows the bear the same size, the 200 mm shot will have a substantial advantage from a resolution standpoint.

But now let's consider the case in which the camera with a different 200 mm lens only affords a focal plane resolution of 50 line pairs per millimeters. Then a corresponding "analysis" will show that there is no advantage, regarding resolution of the final "bear portrait", to that lens over our 100 mm lens.

A colleague here (I wish I could remember who, but I've slept since then) speaks of the concept of the "reach" of a telephoto lens, based on this outlook. What that turns out to mean, in explicit mathematical terms, is the "angular resolution" of the lens. In the sense where a smaller number means better resolution (as when we describe the spacing of the resolved line pairs), it is the angular separation between two points that can be resolved (for the lens of interest on a specific camera).

We are not really that familiar with thinking of object point spacing in terms of angle. But if we only plan to use this parameter to compare different lenses as applied to a certain camera, and wish to work with a definition of resolution in which a larger number is "finer" (as when we cite line pairs per mm, or line pairs per picture height), the the "reach factor" can be thought of as the product of the focal length times the focal plane resolution in line pairs per mm (for the lens on a particular camera). (This gives a large number numerically, but so what.)

In the first example, the 100 mm lens, on our camera, has a "reach factor" of 10,000 (100 mm x 100 lp/mm); the "good" 200 mm lens, on our camera, has a "reach factor" of 20,000 (200 mm x 100 lp/mm).

In the second example, the "alternate" 200 mm lens, on our camera, has a "reach factor" of 10,000 (200 mm x 50 lp/mm).

And so, there is no advantage in using the alternate 200 mm lens, over the 100 mm lens, from a standpoint of final resolution of the delivered bear. (There could be other considerations of focal length alone.)

It is fascinating to take measured resolutions of zoom lenses, over their focal length range, and plotting the "reach factor".

This recently came up where when we contemplated superseding our Sigma 18-200mm lens with a lens having a minimum focal length of about 18 mm but a maximum focal length of 250 or 270 mm. The question is, "will we benefit from the available greater focal length?"

The answer was (from practical testing, not based on such a "plot"), for every candidate we were able to test, "no". In some cases, the reach at the maximum focal length setting was less than at, say, 200 mm.

Note that the impact of this on the choice between two lenses depends on the contribution of the camera to the joint resolution, and thus on the camera to be used.

For example, in a camera with a large pixel pitch, all of the lenses we posited may lead to nearly the same focal plane resolution (basically dictated by the sensor). Then, the longer focal length would always be advantageous from the standpoint of the resolution of the delivered bear.

But today, with sensor system resolution steadily increasing, the contribution of lens resolution to overall resolution is more significant.

So if you really want to get that bear in "HD", be prepared to carry something pretty heavy. But you will have help: your wallet will be considerably lighter.

On the tactical front, we sent out Sigma 18-250 and our Tamron 18-270 back! We gave big hugs to our:

• Sigma 18-200 mm f/3.5-6.3 DC OS
• Canon 24-105 mm f/4.0L IS USM
• Canon 70-200 mm f/2.8 IS USM

and put them back in the bag.

But I may not be climbing the steps to the top row of Cowboys Stadium ever again!
 

StuartRae

New member
Today I will discuss an issue that ........... photographers are aware of it, but may not have a clear idea of the principles behind it, and thus may not be able to clearly articulate it to others.

Thanks Doug. I find it rather comforting to have something that I'm aware of confirmed by a mathematical equation.
Do you perform the resolution tests yourself, or do you use those published, for example, on Photozone?

On a lighter note (please forgive my odd sense of humour which seems to get worse as I get older), it might be useful in providing a practical assessment of a lens to factor in its weight in terms of:
  • the effect it has on your ability to run away should the bear become too inquisitve;
  • the effect of hitting the bear on the head with it should said bear catch up with you.

Regards,

Stuart
 

Cem_Usakligil

Well-known member
Hi Doug,

Thanks for the good article, I have enjoyed reading it as usual. Interestingly, you don't mention the depth of field characteristics of lenses in your post. A picture of the same subject taken with a longer lens using the same camera and the f-number, will result in a lower DOF for the longer lens. So all things being equal re. the "reach factor" (i.e. taking the line resolution into account), if the photographer wants to have a better separation of the background/foreground and the subject, he/she will benefit from using longer lenses.

Another aspect is: if we have the same reach factor: 1 pixel of the image taken with the shorter lens is made up of a lower number of camera sensels than the image taken with the longer lens. This would mean that the image with the longer lens would have a better SNR under less than ideal exposure situations.

Speaking of exposure, the longer lens is at a disadvantage regarding the need for higher shutter speeds.


Cheers,
 
Last edited:

Mike Shimwell

New member
Doug

This was one of the reasons I sold the 70-300DO - I had a strong view that the real world resolution of the 70-200f4Lis on the 1Ds3 at least matched (and usually exceeded) that of the 70-300DO on the 5D, and the depth of field issue is easily taken care of by using a wider aperture on the 70-200 (which is penalised on the 70-300).

Also the 70-200 isbetter ergonomically and it's white:)

Mike
 

Mike Shimwell

New member
Thanks Doug. I find it rather comforting to have something that I'm aware of confirmed by a mathematical equation.
Do you perform the resolution tests yourself, or do you use those published, for example, on Photozone?

On a lighter note (please forgive my odd sense of humour which seems to get worse as I get older), it might be useful in providing a practical assessment of a lens to factor in its weight in terms of:
  • the effect it has on your ability to run away should the bear become too inquisitve;
  • the effect of hitting the bear on the head with it should said bear catch up with you.

Regards,

Stuart


Stuart

You should never hit an innocent animal with a telephoto lens...



a 1 series body is much more effective


Equally to the point - I'm not enamoured of carrying a 70-200 2.8 up Scafell Pike or having it tag along for a day hike from Boot to Bassenthwaite via the 4 3,000s. In fact it's likely the next time I do that walk I'll carry the little ricoh.

Mike
 

Cem_Usakligil

Well-known member
Off-topic

...You should never hit an innocent animal with a telephoto lens..
Hmmm, is the bear innocent until proven guilty? In other words, is it still innocent even after it has chewed your head off? Or perhaps we allowed to hit with a wide lens? lol

Cheers,
(please ignore my misplaced humour)
 

Doug Kerr

Well-known member
Hi, Cem,

Hi Doug,

Thanks for the good article, I have enjoyed reading it as usual. Interestingly, you don't mention the depth of field characteristics of lenses in your post. A picture of the same subject taken with a longer lens using the same camera and the f-number, will result in a lower DOF for the longer lens. So all things being equal re. the "reach factor" (i.e. taking the line resolution into account), if the photographer wants to have a better separation of the background/foreground and the subject, he/she will benefit from using longer lenses.
That's why I included some of the qualifying phrases in my discussion; to set that aspect off to the side (I should probably have mentioned it by name - I almost did). But of course it does enter into the overall scheme of things.

Another aspect is: if we have the same reach factor: 1 pixel of the image taken with the shorter lens is made up of a lower number of camera sensels than the image taken with the longer lens. This would mean that the image with the longer lens would have a better SNR under less than ideal exposure situations.
True if by "pixel" we (for example) mean a screen pixel as the image is sized for screen view, or one printer pixel as the image is interpolated for printing. That's a good point, of which I need to be more aware. Thanks for illuminating it.

Speaking of exposure, the longer lens is at a disadvantage regarding the need for higher shutter speeds.
One can demonstrate that this is not so if:

• we assume cropping of the delivered image to the same "size of the bear".

• our "acceptable blurring" criterion is a certain displacement with respect to the "size of the bear"

Then for both "cases", a certain angular uncertainty ("wobble") in camera aiming will produce the same blurring.

Then if we assume that the amplitude of the wobble varies inversely with shutter speed (the basis of the common "minimum shutter speed" concept), the same shutter speed will be called for in each case.

Isn't this all fun!

Thanks.

Best regards,

Doug
 

Doug Kerr

Well-known member
Hi, STuart,

Thanks Doug. I find it rather comforting to have something that I'm aware of confirmed by a mathematical equation.
Do you perform the resolution tests yourself, or do you use those published, for example, on Photozone?
Well, the remarks about two lenses we had here were totally based on rather superficial judgments of two crops with equal scene content.

On a lighter note (please forgive my odd sense of humour which seems to get worse as I get older), it might be useful in providing a practical assessment of a lens to factor in its weight in terms of:
  • the effect it has on your ability to run away should the bear become too inquisitve;
  • the effect of hitting the bear on the head with it should said bear catch up with you.

Well, I earlier spoke of the salutary effect of adding a 2x focal length converter to a Canon EF 70-200 mm f/2.8 IS insofar as the matter of the person in the seat in front of my seat in the stadium jumping up whenever it looked as if there might be an exciting play.

Best regards,

Doug
 

Doug Kerr

Well-known member
Hi, Mike,

Also the 70-200 is better ergonomically and it's white

A project here that got deferred when we moved from Dallas to Weatherford, and needs to be taken up again, is painting the "child-frightening" hood to match the lens itself (70-200 f/2.8 IS).

Best regards,

Doug
 

Cem_Usakligil

Well-known member
...One can demonstrate that this is not so if:

• we assume cropping of the delivered image to the same "size of the bear".

• our "acceptable blurring" criterion is a certain displacement with respect to the "size of the bear"

Then for both "cases", a certain angular uncertainty ("wobble") in camera aiming will produce the same blurring.

Then if we assume that the amplitude of the wobble varies inversely with shutter speed (the basis of the common "minimum shutter speed" concept), the same shutter speed will be called for in each case.

Isn't this all fun!
Hi Doug,

This is big fun indeed! But re. the part you've written above, I have divided feelings. My gut feeling tells me that we are missing something here. Let me put it this way with an example of two lenses @100mm and @200mm. We need to shoot the "bear" filling the most of the frame at 1/200s. If your theory is correct, when we switch to the 100mm, we still have to shoot at 1/200s to compensate for the same amount of "wobble" whereas I would expect that a frame taken at 1/100s would help get rid of the wobble regardless of the size of the subject (e.g. the bear filling the half of the frame). In other words, the resulting pixel displacement for the same wobble should be, IMO, greater for a longer lens. But again, this is no proof, just a gut feeling. I am more than willing to be educated about the truth :)

Cheers,
 

Doug Kerr

Well-known member
This is to follow up, on a point Cem well made a little bit ago in this thread.

Just in case anyone here gets confused about DoF comparisons in the face of different focal lengths, format sized, croppings, and the like (hard to believe, isn't it!), consider two cases, with:

• the focal length in case B twice that in case A,
• the same f number
• the same focus distance/distance to the principal subject
• the delivered image cropped to the same "scene content"
• the same maximum acceptable diameter of the circle of confusion as a fraction of the cropped image size

Then the depth of field in case B will be almost exactly half that of case A.

Thanks, Cem, for reminding us of this.

Best regards,

Doug
 

Mike Shimwell

New member
Hi Doug,

This is big fun indeed! But re. the part you've written above, I have divided feelings. My gut feeling tells me that we are missing something here. Let me put it this way with an example of two lenses @100mm and @200mm. We need to shoot the "bear" filling the most of the frame at 1/200s. If your theory is correct, when we switch to the 100mm, we still have to shoot at 1/200s to compensate for the same amount of "wobble" whereas I would expect that a frame taken at 1/100s would help get rid of the wobble regardless of the size of the subject (e.g. the bear filling the half of the frame). In other words, the resulting pixel displacement for the same wobble should be, IMO, greater for a longer lens. But again, this is no proof, just a gut feeling. I am more than willing to be educated about the truth :)

Cheers,

Hi Cem

I'm with Doug on this one. I find sensitivity to motion (wobble) blur is dependent on image magnification, so a print from the 100 witht eh same subject size has twice the magnification of the print from the 200. Hence you will be twice as sensitive to motion blur in the print, but half as sensitive at the focal plane (because of the shorter focal length) hence the same shutter speed will be required.

Of course, if your blur is too small to be resolved by the pixel resolution of the sensor then you may get a bit of leeway. Certainly, 21Mp bodies are more sensitive to good technique in holding them still than 12Mp.

Mike
 

Doug Kerr

Well-known member
Out-of-focus blur

This may be a good place to call attention to this matter, which is often not recognized.

When we discuss depth of field, we are asking "over what range of object distances will the image of the object not be blurred beyond a certain limit that we adopt."

But when we speak of the matter of separating the background from the main subject, the issue is actually a different one (although of course the two are directly related). Here, the question is, "with the camera focused at a certain distance, then for some 'background' object at a specific greater distance, how much will the background object be blurred."

We rarely hear this spoken of numerically, and there are few calculators that allow this to be determined handily.

So we say, "Well, if the depth of field is less than so-and-so, then no doubt the amount of blurring of background items will be enough to do our artistic job." How much do we want? We have no idea. How much will we get? We have no idea. But if the DoF is "less", then the amount of blurring will be "more" - maybe "enough".

I happen to have a calculator for this. You can get it here:

http://doug.kerr.home.att.net/pumpkin/#OFBCalculator

If we look at two cases with "reasonable numbers", then for this situation:

• Focal length in Case B twice that in Case A
• Same f/number
• Same focus distance
• Crops containing the same scene material
• Same distance to a background object being considered

then the degree of blurring (actual diameter of the circle of confusion) of that background object, reckoned as a fraction of the dimensions of the delivered image, will be very nearly twice as much for case B (greater focal length), as for case A.

Best regards,

Doug
 

Cem_Usakligil

Well-known member
Hi Cem

I'm with Doug on this one. I find sensitivity to motion (wobble) blur is dependent on image magnification, so a print from the 100 witht eh same subject size has twice the magnification of the print from the 200. Hence you will be twice as sensitive to motion blur in the print, but half as sensitive at the focal plane (because of the shorter focal length) hence the same shutter speed will be required.

Of course, if your blur is too small to be resolved by the pixel resolution of the sensor then you may get a bit of leeway. Certainly, 21Mp bodies are more sensitive to good technique in holding them still than 12Mp.

Mike
Hi Mike,

While this all makes good sense, and I actually agree given the parameters you've mentioned, I still think differently. Let's take the tilting of the lens due to a wobble. The angle of view ratio between the longer lens and the shorter one is not linear wrt to the focal length but let's assume that it is 2:1 for the practical purposes of the 100mm vs 200mm. Therefore, a certain tilt of the lens along the axis (due to a wobble) when using a longer lens is going to cause twice the percentage of total image shift, compared to the shift in case of a shorter lens. This shift is regardless of the size of the subject. Both large or small subjects will be shifted by x% for the shorter lens and the shift will be twice for the longer lens. Example: angle of view for 35mm equivalent sensor for 100mm: 20degrees and for 200mm 10 degrees. A tilt of 1degree along the axis will give a 20% shift for the 200mm and a 10% shift for the 100mm. If the sensor is 24mm high and the bear's image on the sensor is 20mm high, then a 20% shift with the long lens will cause a displacement of the bear by 4mm on the sensor. If the bear is 10mm on the sensor wtih the short lens, then the 10% shift caused by the same wobble will result in a shift of 1mm on the sensor. Even when the size is doubled for the output to make both images the same size, the resulting shift will be 2mm for the shorter lens compared to the shift of 4mm with the longer lens. Ergo, the shutter time of the longer lens should still be twice faster to have the same amount shift. I hope I am making some sense here ;-)

Cheers,
 

Doug Kerr

Well-known member
Hi, Cem,

This is big fun indeed! But re. the part you've written above, I have divided feelings. My gut feeling tells me that we are missing something here.
The actual model of "camera shake" is very complex, I'm sure, and so the model we use to get a "guideline" is pretty naïve.

But, on the premise of "If we believe that, we should believe this", its not unreasonable to follow that model to try and guess how two differnt situations compare.

So let me do a little blackboard exercise. I'm making this up as I go.

Case A

We'll start with a 100 mm lens (let's say on a camera with a 36 mm x 24 mm sensor, although it turns out that this won't matter). We take a shot of our faithful bear. We find that the image we want to "present" will be a 9 mm x 6 mm crop from this shot. Its diagonal dimension is around 10 mm.

Now, imagine that, during a 1/100 sec exposure, the "shake" displaces the camera axis over an angle of 0.0001 radian.

With a 100 mm focal length, that will result in the image being "smeared" by a distance of about 0.01 mm (we assume focus at a significant distance so the distance from the lens to the focal plane is essentially the focal length). [0.0001 radian x 100 mm = 0.01 mm.]

That smearing is about 1/1000 of the diagonal dimension of the cropped area what will become the delivered image. [10/1000 = 0.01]

That might well be "just acceptable".

Case B

Now we mount a 200 mm lens. To get the same scene content in the delivered image, the "crop" now needs to be 18 mm x 12 mm. Its diagonal dimension is around 20 mm.

We will assume that during that same 1/100 sec exposure the displacement of the camera axis due to shake is the same as before: 0.001 radian.

With a 200 mm focal length, that will result in the image being "smeared" by a distance of about 0.02 mm. [0.0001 radian x 200 mm = 0.02 mm.]

That smearing is about 1/1000 of the diagonal dimension of the cropped area that will become the delivered image. [20/1000 = 0.02]

Thus we can say that the smearing is the same.

That tells us that if 1/100 sec was a good choice for Case A, then it is equally good for Case B.

Quod erat demonstrandum.

Best regards,

Doug
 

Cem_Usakligil

Well-known member
Hi Doug,

Thank you for the very good demo, I agree with you for this kind of "wobble" the math is right (except the divisor of 1000 in case B should have been 2000, but the rest of the math is still correct). However, I am not yet 100% convinced (due to the fact that a wobble is not only a tilt but a combination of tilts and shifts of the camera). However until I can prove otherwise, I'll tag along with your judgment nevertheless :).

Cheers,
 

Doug Kerr

Well-known member
Hi, Cem,

Thank you for the very good demo, I agree with you for this kind of "wobble" the math is right (except the divisor of 1000 in case B should have been 2000, but the rest of the math is still correct).
I don't think so. In Case B, the smearing is 1/1000 the image diagonal, just as in Case A (that's what the "1000" represents). My presentation might "proceed in the wrong direction" in that area - I did that to, hopefully, improve comprehension, but that may have been a flop.

The more "forward-moving" presentation (for Case B) would have been:

The smearing, compared to the image diagonal, would be 0.001 times as large (1/1000). [0.02/20=0.001, or 1/1000]​

However, I am not yet 100% convinced (due to the fact that a wobble is not only a tilt but a combination of tilts and shifts of the camera).
Absolutely that is a consideration (the latest Canon IS in fact addresses both aspects of "wobble").

I think for an object at a substantial distance, the "translational" ("shift") aspect of the wobble probably becomes insignificant compared to the "rotational" ("tilt") aspect.

For closer objects, then the "translational" aspect certainly comes into significant play (which is why the new Canon IS appears first on a macro lens).

In any case, the full reality of this situation is far beyond my model, so who knows exactly how the two results would compare in real life.

The most important flaw in the classical model is the assumption that the shift is proportional to shutter time. In addition, the classical "guideline" makes some unstated presumption about the probabilities involved.

A sophisticated presentation would be something like this (this is just a made-up example):

A shutter speed of 1/f' (where f' is the full-frame 35-mm equivalent focal length in mm) will produce smearing of not over 1/1200 of the image diagonal in 90% of the shots taken by the "median" photographer, for an object at a distance of at least 50 f'.​

And of course we have no such characterization! (But this may in fact appear in a published study someplace!)

Best regards,

Doug
 

Cem_Usakligil

Well-known member
Hi, Cem,
I don't think so. In Case B, the smearing is 1/1000 the image diagonal, just as in Case A (that's what the "1000" represents). My presentation might "proceed in the wrong direction" in that area - I did that to, hopefully, improve comprehension, but that may have been a flop....
No, it is not a flop. Just careless reading on my part, my apologies :).

...Absolutely that is a consideration (the latest Canon IS in fact addresses both aspects of "wobble").

I think for an object at a substantial distance, the "translational" ("shift") aspect of the wobble probably becomes insignificant compared to the "rotational" ("tilt") aspect.

For closer objects, then the "translational" aspect certainly comes into significant play (which is why the new Canon IS appears first on a macro lens).

In any case, the full reality of this situation is far beyond my model, so who knows exactly how the two results would compare in real life.

The most important flaw in the classical model is the assumption that the shift is proportional to shutter time. In addition, the classical "guideline" makes some unstated presumption about the probabilities involved.

A sophisticated presentation would be something like this (this is just a made-up example):
A shutter speed of 1/f' (where f' is the full-frame 35-mm equivalent focal length in mm) will produce smearing of not over 1/1200 of the image diagonal in 90% of the shots taken by the "median" photographer, for an object at a distance of at least 50 f'.​
And of course we have no such characterization! (But this may in fact appear in a published study someplace!) ...
Very well put, thanks again. PS: I know a pumpkin patch somewhere for locating a future publication ;-)
 

Doug Kerr

Well-known member
Hi, Cem,

I have found a very pertinent contemporary paper on the matter of the camera shake model, done at Stanford in connection with work on "camera phones":

http://scien.stanford.edu/jfsite/Papers/ImageCapture/ICIS06_CameraShake.pdf

These researchers are not in the "Tokyo SLR club" and so don't have access to the work in this area that has doubtless been done in modern times in connection with the development of image stabilization systems. And they conclude, politely, that perhaps there isn't as much "ancient" wisdom as we might think.

I plan to soon post (separately from this thread) my initial learning from this paper, but here is one punch line.

First note that this study dealt solely with the "rotational" displacement, not "translational". (It essentially assumed the subject to be at a significant distance.)

The study recognized the effect of what they describe as "camera mass" on the phenomenon: a "heavier" camera will shake less, in the same hands, than a lighter one. (Actually, the parameter of interest is almost certainly not mass per se but rather moment of inertia; of course, for the same "shape", moment of inertia does vary with mass.

The real punch line of the study is this. Our classical guideline, in which the shutter speed guideline is based on focal length, essentially assumes that the angular displacement of the camera axis during the exposure is proportional to exposure time (which I have never "bought").

(Of course, the variation is statistically random, so we should perhaps say that the guideline is based on the assumption that the standard deviation of the angular displacement during the exposure is proportional to exposure time.)

This study shows that, in fact (for any given "setup", including camera mass, "skill level" of the photographer, image size, and focal length) the standard deviation of the displacement of the axis during the exposure goes as about the 0.56 power of the exposure time.

If we follow this through all the equations, this tells us that:

• If for a focal length of 100 mm, with a shutter speed of 1/100 sec, the smearing is "just acceptable", then
• For a focal length of 200 mm, the shutter speed to attain the same smearing criterion would need to be about 1/350 sec (not 1/200 sec, as produced by the "guideline").
• For a focal length of 50 mm, the shutter speed to attain the same smearing criterion would need to be about 1/30 sec (not 1/50 sec, as produced by the "guideline").

Way fascinating. More after breakfast.

Best regards,

Doug
 

Cem_Usakligil

Well-known member
Hi Doug,

This is truly fascinating indeed:

.....
If we follow this through all the equations, this tells us that:

• If for a focal length of 100 mm, with a shutter speed of 1/100 sec, the smearing is "just acceptable", then
• For a focal length of 200 mm, the shutter speed to attain the same smearing criterion would need to be about 1/350 sec (not 1/200 sec, as produced by the "guideline").
• For a focal length of 50 mm, the shutter speed to attain the same smearing criterion would need to be about 1/30 sec (not 1/50 sec, as produced by the "guideline").
...
There is much to ponder about this....


.. More after breakfast...
What's on the menu for the breakfast of the champions today? Enjoy!

Cheers,
 

Doug Kerr

Well-known member
Hi, Cem,

This is truly fascinating indeed:

There is much to ponder about this....
Indeed!

What's on the menu for the breakfast of the champions today?

I had actually meant to mention that, but didn't.

Fresh grapefruit, apple, and orange, plus oatmeal ("real") with raisins and cinnamon; news bulletins from the New York Times and the Washington Post; and (best of all) conversation with a bright and beautiful Cherokee redhead.

You've seen pictures of grapefruit before, but I thought I would illustrate the latter (this is from about four years ago):

Carla_E05810RR.jpg

Douglas A. Kerr: Carla

Best regards,

Doug
 

Cem_Usakligil

Well-known member
...You've seen pictures of grapefruit before, but I thought I would illustrate the latter (this is from about four years ago):

Carla_E05810RR.jpg

Douglas A. Kerr: Carla

Best regards,

Doug
Hi Doug,

Enjoying this "scenery" while having breakfast is simply priceless! It is the breakfast of the champions, indeed :)

PS: Would you like me to tidy up this thread by moving the off-topic bits to elsewhere?

Cheers,
 
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