Photoshop is dead, long live the Adobe Creative Cloud

Doug Kerr said:

Thanks for the tip. I have downloaded and installed Photoline on a trial basis and will be playing with it.

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Hi Doug,

You're welcome. I'd appreciate to learn your findings, because you have a keen eye for potential issues (le crayon rouge). The authors seem to be Germans who in general, like those from Scottish descent, have a more trustworthy reputation in doing business than Adobe.

Speaking of certain Germans (and some Austrians), I hope some of us can also appreciate this as a creative way to vent some steam:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=67Iw9q2X9cU It's a bit difficult to follow if one understands German, just concentrate on the sub-titles.

Cheers,
Bart

Photoline seems, so far from the tutorials, to have enough of PS behaviors to be able to transition to. It has masks and blending modes like photoshop and layers too. Worth investigating and the price is very reasonable. I haven't found "puppet warp" yet, but no doubt everything will be made as photoshop. For the price, it's worth having around to work a picture say once a week, so that when CS6 can't be booted up on one's new computer, the latest Photoline, by then pretty popular and rich in even more options, will be a simple transition.

This seems like a greatt escape-route from PS besides GIMP.

Another wonderful discovery is Bibble 5 which has really intuitive selective editing features. This tutorial is worth looking at. If one uses Capture One, them Bibble 5 is so close one could pick it up, I think in not time at all. Aslo they have interesting plugins.

Thanks again, Bart!

Asher

Hi, Bart,

Bart_van_der_Wolf said:

Hi Doug,

You're welcome. I'd appreciate to learn your findings, because you have a keen eye for potential issues (le crayon rouge). The authors seem to be Germans who in general, like those from Scottish descent, have a more trustworthy reputation in doing business than Adobe.

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Aye, lad.

Speaking of certain Germans (and some Austrians), I hope some of us can also appreciate this as a creative way to vent some steam:

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Well, Austrians are like just Germans, but more so.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=67Iw9q2X9cU It's a bit difficult to follow if one understands German, just concentrate on the sub-titles.

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Fabulous!

Well, I never started to drink alcoholic beverages, I never started to smoke, I never started to use illegal drugs, and I have always edited all my pix in Micrografx Picture Publisher.

Thanks.

Best regards,

Doug

After all this, I'm beginning to think its not a bad idea.
Adobe need to make a buck, we need good software, its not going to cost me any more or less, so what's the problem?
No, don't tell me again.
I look forward to the change.

Tom dinning said:

After all this, I'm beginning to think its not a bad idea.
Adobe need to make a buck, we need good software, its not going to cost me any more or less, so what's the problem?
No, don't tell me again.
I look forward to the change.

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Hi Tom,

I'm a bit puzzled by your comments, probably just as intended by you ..., so help me to understand.

It's only not going to cost you any more or less, when you do not hop along the perpetual money tap, called Creative Cloud. All others pay an increased amount of cash, and have no certainty that they can access their Works-in-Progress images in the future. That also cannot be good news for your students. 'Heaven' forbid that they get any training in using an industry standard tool to process their creative products, that they will not be able to afford in their professional career. That would be a waste of their tuition, wouldn't it?

What is the change you are looking for?

Cheers,
Bart

Bart_van_der_Wolf said:

Hi Tom,

I'm a bit puzzled by your comments, probably just as intended by you ..., so help me to understand.

It's only not going to cost you any more or less, when you do not hop along the perpetual money tap, called Creative Cloud. All others pay an increased amount of cash, and have no certainty that they can access their Works-in-Progress images in the future. That also cannot be good news for your students. 'Heaven' forbid that they get any training in using an industry standard tool to process their creative products, that they will not be able to afford in their professional career. That would be a waste of their tuition, wouldn't it?

What is the change you are looking for?

Cheers,
Bart

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I don't tell people how to run their business, Bart, just how to use the tools. How they allocate their finances to do what they need is their business. If you can't afford the tools your not really going to have much of a business. If adobe offers an option and the businessman wants to use it they need to allocate the cash however it happens. If they don't want to spend the cash they go elsewhere. For those who go with adobe they don't or shouldn't go in blindly, as with any contract. Read the fine print and decide. Simple.
Weare not being forced into anything here. It's a business decision by Adobe for whatever reason. It has to be good for adobe otherwise they wouldn't make it. If it fails, which I doubt, then they go another way. I'm included to think this is the way in the future for a lot more software developers. I already have subscriptions for other software and its no effort at all. None of it is in photography so that will be new ground.
I need CS because I teach it. Whichever way, I will allocate the funds. It's not all I teach. Providing the students with the information to make an informed decision is what I hope I can do. Without prejudice, I hope. Personally, many of my students are advised to use other things because I know they would be wasting money on something so comprehensive. At least until they decide if spending the money is what they want to do. Those students in the future won't know any difference but the choice is still the same. Will I or won't I?

Tom dinning said:

We are not being forced into anything here.

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I beg to differ on this, like a junkie to a dealer should, but can't.

Photoshop is the de facto standard application for image processing in preparation to (traditionally pre-press) output, with little or no competition. When the cost of ownership multiplies overnight, people can be threatened in their commercial viability. On e.g. the Luminous Landscape forums an owner of a design studio is confronted by an increase of €6k per year to €26k per year, only due to a policy change by Adobe. And his example is not unique.

It's a business decision by Adobe for whatever reason. It has to be good for adobe otherwise they wouldn't make it.

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The future will tell. Sofar it doesn't look like it. Their stock value lost some 6% in the last week on an increasing NASDAQ, after the announcement, and they've earned the new #35 most shorted Nasdaq 100 Component status. Adobe Systems (ADBE) pushed the Computer Software & Services industry lower making it the featured Computer Software & Services laggard last week. Photography related internet fora have been flooded with posts by concerned users of photo-editing software. Adobe has sent executives on travel to appear in talk-shows to control the controversy.

I need CS because I teach it.

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Well CS is no more. Creative Cloud (CC) is the new kid on the block, it's (much) more expensive, and it will potentially not allow to open one's work-in-progress files if they are based on new functionality that supposedly is going to be rolled out more frequently, when the verification of a subscription (for whatever reason) fails.

Whichever way, I will allocate the funds. It's not all I teach. Providing the students with the information to make an informed decision is what I hope I can do. Without prejudice, I hope.

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Bravo for you, and good for your students.

Personally, many of my students are advised to use other things because I know they would be wasting money on something so comprehensive. At least until they decide if spending the money is what they want to do. Those students in the future won't know any difference but the choice is still the same. Will I or won't I?

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Absolutely, and hopefully well informed.

Which still leaves the question: What is the change you are looking for?

We have a membership with a broad range of capabilities and talents, but clairvoyance seems to be relatively under-represented, artsy fartsy on the other hand thrives at times. All are welcome.

Cheers,
Bart

Bart_van_der_Wolf said:

I beg to differ on this, like a junkie to a dealer should, but can't.

Photoshop is the de facto standard application for image processing in preparation to (traditionally pre-press) output, with little or no competition. When the cost of ownership multiplies overnight, people can be threatened in their commercial viability. On e.g. the Luminous Landscape forums an owner of a design studio is confronted by an increase of €6k per year to €26k per year, only due to a policy change by Adobe. And his example is not unique.



The future will tell. Sofar it doesn't look like it. Their stock value lost some 6% in the last week on an increasing NASDAQ, after the announcement, and they've earned the new #35 most shorted Nasdaq 100 Component status. Adobe Systems (ADBE) pushed the Computer Software & Services industry lower making it the featured Computer Software & Services laggard last week. Photography related internet fora have been flooded with posts by concerned users of photo-editing software. Adobe has sent executives on travel to appear in talk-shows to control the controversy.



Well CS is no more. Creative Cloud (CC) is the new kid on the block, it's (much) more expensive, and it will potentially not allow to open one's work-in-progress files if they are based on new functionality that supposedly is going to be rolled out more frequently, when the verification of a subscription (for whatever reason) fails.



Bravo for you, and good for your students.



Absolutely, and hopefully well informed.

Which still leaves the question: What is the change you are looking for?

We have a membership with a broad range of capabilities and talents, but clairvoyance seems to be relatively under-represented, artsy fartsy on the other hand thrives at times. All are welcome.

Cheers,
Bart

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Relax, Bart, I'm not looking for anything, least of all to have an argument about something I don't have a lot of control over or that anyone is about to take any notice of (me, that is). I'll take it as it comes. Like the banks changing interest rates and the railway upping their fairs or the current government changing the superannuation rules. Have you read those? Oh, I forgot. You guys don't have superannuation, do you. What a nightmare. There is more fine print than you'd find in a bible. And here's the funny thing. It's compulsory!

Have I got a point to make. I'm not sure but it does seem we have a whine about change and down the track when another one comes along we whine about the good old days all over again.
At the end of the day I couldnt care less if you choose to use cloud or whatever it's called. And me using it shouldn't really affect what you do. So, I'm not about to convince you either way. All I said was I think it's fair enough. I don't really have to explain it to anyone. And neither does Adobe.

Call it a conspiracy, an indictment, a travesty, a fraud, an injustice and at the end of the day make your choice.

Lets hope we both still have the opportunity to continue posting here. I enjoy your images and I promise never to ask what post processing software you use.

Cheers

Tom

Asher Kelman said:

Photoline seems, so far from the tutorials, to have enough of PS behaviors to be able to transition to. It has masks and blending modes like photoshop and layers too. Worth investigating and the price is very reasonable. I haven't found "puppet warp" yet, but no doubt everything will be made as photoshop. For the price, it's worth having around to work a picture say once a week, so that when CS6 can't be booted up on one's new computer, the latest Photoline, by then pretty popular and rich in even more options, will be a simple transition.

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That's the idea. For those who need Photoshop functionality, their current CS6 (or earlier version) perpetual licence version may last a while longer without an immediate need to decide for/against a Cloud subscription, until an Operating System upgrade, or a hardware malfunction, forces a move to something else.

While it doesn't have a user interface as slick looking as Photoshop's, Photoline seems to be an extremely capable alternative (even superior in some aspects) for a very modest price. It's available for Windows and Macintosh platforms.

It's evidently a product made by quite capable software engineers, very well thought out and feature rich, but a bit lacking in the presentation. But hey, it doesn't clutter the harddisk-space (the Win 64-bit version occupies less than 50MB on my harddisk), has adjustment layers and masks, and works with existing plugins such as from e.g. Topaz-Labs and FocusMagic. It even allows proper downsampling with a Lanczos-3 resampling filter.

Here are some informative instruction videos made by a user to quickly get up to speed with Photoline:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=I6dYTUBnf2o
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ls7MjX_GyiI
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Tc3PuhaSwXk
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KsOXwlbEf1M
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M29xJCs6NTY
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QhYw-mFhuB4
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OIBBolXf9h8

Cheers,
Bart