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  • Welcome to the new site. Here's a thread about the update where you can post your feedback, ask questions or spot those nasty bugs!

Review: Serious ND filters: a Review. Add your own experiences!

Asher Kelman

OPF Owner/Editor-in-Chief
Dan Siman is selling the popular Big Stopper Lee filter that allows ~ 10 stops of light dimming of your scene. This enables one to get rich colors and movement of clouds and water.

It's on backorder in most places, (~$165), so there's a 3 - 6 month wait and so some will be lucky enough to sell their filter for a big profit.

There's a great review of the filter here.

It covers using the filter with a graduated ND filter too. Worth the read!

Add your own experience with ND filters to solve lighting problems!

Asher
 
I use 2- and 3-stop ND gel filters on my strobes in my studio when I need light levels lower than can be achieved with the power control.

I have a 3-stop B+W ND filter for my camera that I bought to extend exposure times when shooting waterfalls, ocean waves, etc. But, I very seldom use it because it's too dark to see through to frame and focus. And screw-on filters aren't convenient to remove for focus then reattach for exposure.

I can't imagine using a 10-stop ND, but I can't imagine using 8 X 10 film either, so it indicates an imagination limitation rather than an objection.
 

Asher Kelman

OPF Owner/Editor-in-Chief
Well, Charles,

For 8x10 film we sometimes use ISO 200-800 ISO film and that's already loaded into my film holders and then the sun comes out and one has to use what one has. Also there are advantages to use certain lenses wide open, say at f 4.5 for soft focus. So one certainly would need to have flexibility. For some old barrel lenses, I just have one Packard shutter at 1/25 second! For others, my top speed is 1/150 sec in a Copal 1 shutter.

Without having ND filters, one could be stuck very easily.

I realized that with ISO 800 film when I had to use my PS945 lens, (a gem at f 4.5), at f 16 instead because i had no ND filter or other film!

With my Packard shutter, I have place for 5 filters, all 6.6cm x 6.6 cm. I can add 100 mm filters on a second filter holder inside the camera on a 100 mm square filter holder behind the rear lens element as it protrudes back inside the LF camera bellows.

Asher
 

Greg Norrell

New member
I sometimes use a B+W 6 stop ND filter (ND1.8, 64x) and like it better than a Hoya ND4 that I also have. I have yet to see an ND filter that was truly neutral. They always shift colors a bit. The Hoya increases the green. The B+W enhances the longer wavelengths which is more logical, easier to compensate for, and actually tends to enhance the image. It will make red rocks really stand out. Although it's 6 stops, the camera can still focus (although it's a bit hard to see through.
 

John Wolf

New member
I have two B+W solid NDs -- 3-stop and 6-stop -- that I bought quite inexpensively on ebay. I use them separately and stacked with various step-down rings.

I tried a few cheaper models, but the color shift was unacceptable. I find the B+Ws to be pretty good.

Focusing and composing used to be a pain, but LiveView has pretty much eliminated that issue.

John

_MG_4635.jpg
 

John Wolf

New member
Thanks, everyone. It's still a bit skewed optically, but it's straight by the Lightroom grid. Appreciate your comments. Although we kinda got off-track with the ND filters.

John
 
Thanks, everyone. It's still a bit skewed optically, but it's straight by the Lightroom grid. Appreciate your comments. Although we kinda got off-track with the ND filters.

John

I think it's just the tilt of the area where everyone is standing/walking that gives an appearance of the horizon being tilted.
 

Daniel Perez

New member
Asher,

I own the Lee Big Stopper. I don't know that I would say that it enables one to get rich colors, after all it's supposed to be a “neutral” density filter. However, long exposures taken with this filter do get a strong blue cast, which is easily removed during RAW processing.

I have been using it with my 8x10 loaded with Kodak Portra 400 film. I have yet to process any of my 8x10 film, so I don’t know how the film behaves with this filter. I'll update you once the negs are processed.

-DP

Dan Siman is selling the popular Big Stopper Lee filter that allows ~ 10 stops of light dimming of your scene. This enables one to get rich colors and movement of clouds and water.

It's on backorder in most places, (~$165), so there's a 3 - 6 month wait and so some will be lucky enough to sell their filter for a big profit.

There's a great review of the filter here.

It covers using the filter with a graduated ND filter too. Worth the read!

Add your own experience with ND filters to solve lighting problems!

Asher
 

Ben Rubinstein

pro member
Have you thought of one of the vari-ND filters Asher? Either that or stacking a couple of filters will give you 10 stops far cheaper, more versatile and faster than waiting for the elusive Lee big stop.
 

Jerome Marot

Well-known member
I just bought a cheap ND 3.0 / 1000x filter today. It is made in China and sold under the brand haida.

Since a big problem with these filters is the color balance, I tested it with a Xrite colorchecker test card. Here are the results:


The filter with no white balance correction:


ND1000 filter, no WB correction

The same picture, white balanced on the middle gray patch:


ND1000 filter, with WB correction


For comparison, the same chart without filter:
(obviously at a lower iso and smaller aperture)


Without ND1000 filter

It would seem that this filter works quite well, at least on that camera (it may be that this particular camera has a very efficient IR filter and that the ND filter still has IR leak which may show on another camera with a poorer IR filter, a quick check with a modified camera with no IR filter shows some IR leakage indeed). And I don't know whether all the filters sold under that brand name work as well. Caveat emptor.
 
I just bought a cheap ND 3.0 / 1000x filter today. It is made in China and sold under the brand haida.

Since a big problem with these filters is the color balance, I tested it with a Xrite colorchecker test card.

Hi Jerome,

Looks quite good, thanks to the built in IR filter. The Red looks slightly brighter, but the overall color balance looks okay.

Any info about pricing? Where did you get it, direct?

Cheers,
Bart
 

Asher Kelman

OPF Owner/Editor-in-Chief
B&H sells variable ND filters from $28 to $440!

I see a lot of comments all over the board from dark donuts of X shading appearing as one goes darker. Still a lot of folks have great praise.

At $250, the LightCraft ND filter has two reviews. One of them caught my attention.

Andrew Taran said:
As you know, Fader NDs can cause soft image at longer focal lengths, colour cast and vignetting, but not this guy! Outstanding build quality and good optical performance! No vignetting even on maximum setting, sharp, crisp image even at 200mm.

Is that true? Where is the explanation/logic for ND filters giving softer images at longer focal lengths?

Hoya Variable ND filter, $199 reported by one user to have a dark belt developing starting in the corners at 6 stops ND. 9 other users reported no problems.

Tiffen Variable ND filter $149

"Two suggestions: Tiffen should include a lens cap with this filter. Otherwise, when mounted on lens, especially in the field, very hard to keep clean. Also, filter can easily become too tight on the lens barrel. Filter wrench can remove, but a trick I learned is to run a sharp pencil along the filter threads. Graphite acts like a lubricant."

"Very poor results with this Neutral Density filter. Out of 78 shots, everyone but 6 had an X across the picture, sometimes very faint and sometimes very pronounced. The 6 that did not have the X were at the very minimal setting of the Neutral Density Filter and didn't come close to any effect. The instructions said you could get this X but only on the very highest density setting. For me it was on all settings, I'm not sure if it was just my luck or this is a bad unit, however I did see a few reviews where some had the same results. I was using this on a Nikon D800E with a 28 to 300mm 3.5 lens."

So I'd check your filter on arrival throughout its density range for the band and X shading effects and also do multiple color checks and repeat for different focal lengths and lenses.

I can't see anything consistently better yet, maybe the Hoya, but I'm still reading reviews!

Asher
 

Asher Kelman

OPF Owner/Editor-in-Chief
One interesting note is that Schneider Optics recommends using the variable setup of any maker, at less than the max possible density to prevent the X and belt effects, especially with focal lengths less then 50mm. Source

"Note! An anomaly may occur when using a Variable ND filter when shooting wide angle (50mm and below) near to or at the highest ND point on the filter. The anomoly can be a very dark area in the center of the image, or an “X” pattern with lighter frame edges.
For optimal performance, we always recommend using these filters on manual exposure. Vari-ND filters are best used for video capture at any aperture or wide aperture, high shutter speed still shooting. Schneider Optics does not recommend Vari-ND filters for smaller aperture, long exposure still shooting."


Schneider_VaiableND_Kit.png


What's nice here is that Schneider Optics is perfectly open about how their kit is made. It just consists of a standard linear Polarizing square filters with a circular polarizer in front of it. Just rotate the front polarizer to get the desired density effect. That means one can build one's own variable filter for little cost. The key is not to use it at near full ND effect. Of course, with cheaper components, one might have some color shifts but these can be often corrected for most uses. Still for pro work, I'd be more comfortable with the best. I'd beware of Singh Ray, as I've seen one report of the image being divided into quadrants of varying density.

Schneider optics claim for their variable filter is to color purity, although I've not seen color chart tests.

But it does appear a smart rule to make a WB reference no matter what brand of ND filter one is using. This is certainly true for the B&W fixed 10 stop filter which is very warm and similar the Lee "Big Stopper" which is decidedly cool Excellent review of these 10 stop filters. The latter seems to be so well regarded and the price is moderate that it's a good pick for a better class filter with an intermediate price at $140 from B&H, if it's in stock!!

As the saying goes, Trust but verify" !!

Asher
 
To avoid some confusion: the filter I presented is not variable.

Hi Jerome,

And that usually provides higher image quality than a variable ND filter, which is built up from many more layers that all reduce image quality a bit. I prefer dedicated fixed ND filters, especially for such extreme densities.

As it seems, the only thing to look out for with the filter you got, is the alumin(i)um (instead of brass) based mounting ring, especially the thin versions. To avoid getting its threads stuck on the lens' threads, one can use a sharp hard pencil, it's graphite will act as a lubricant.

Cheers,
Bart
 

Cem_Usakligil

Well-known member
Hi Jerome,

I have just ordered the new version which is multi coated. It is a bit more expensive (44.90 Euro) but they do not charge shipping costs.

Website and the Amazon.de link.

I will come back with some test results when I receive it.

PS: I have been resisting to buying an ND x1000 filter because it is easy to fall into the pitfall of shooting "cliche" photos. I will have to pay attention that it doesn't become a gimmick. ;)
 

Cem_Usakligil

Well-known member
Hi Jerome,

I have just ordered the new version which is multi coated. It is a bit more expensive (44.90 Euro) but they do not charge shipping costs.

Website and the Amazon.de link.

I will come back with some test results when I receive it.

PS: I have been resisting to buying an ND x1000 filter because it is easy to fall into the pitfall of shooting "cliche" photos. I will have to pay attention that it doesn't become a gimmick. ;)
As promised, here are the initial test results.

The filter has arrived this afternoon and I have just had the time to grab two test shots at our town square and also shot the color checker charts and created custom camera profiles using the DNG Profile Editor.

First, the color charts:

1) Color charts without the filter and with the filter, using the Adobe Standard profile, both set to the same WB value (i.e. not yet white balanced by clicking on a grey square).

i11350_adobe_nowb.jpg

Without the ND1000 filter, not white balanced, Adobe Standard Profile (f/5.6, 1/100 sec, ISO100)

i11351_adobe_nowb_ND1000.jpg

With the ND1000 filter, not white balanced, Adobe Standard Profile (f/5.6, 10 sec, ISO100)


2) Color charts without the filter and with the filter, using the Adobe Standard profile, white balanced by clicking on the third square from right on the bottom row.

i11350_adobe_wb.jpg

Without the ND1000 filter, white balanced, Adobe Standard Profile (f/5.6, 1/100 sec, ISO100)

i11351_adobe_wb_ND1000.jpg

With the ND1000 filter, white balanced, Adobe Standard Profile (f/5.6, 10 sec, ISO100)

...continued in the next post...
 

Cem_Usakligil

Well-known member
... continued from the previous post:

3) Color charts without the filter and with the filter, using the custom profiles created, white balanced by clicking on the third square from right on the bottom row.

i11350_DNGprofile_WB.jpg

Without the ND1000 filter, white balanced, Custom Profile (f/5.6, 1/100 sec, ISO100)

i11351_DNGprofile_WB_ND1000.jpg

With the ND1000 filter, white balanced, Custom Profile (f/5.6, 10 sec, ISO100)


4) Town square without and with the ND1000 filter, white balanced and using the custom profiles:

i11339_DNGprofile_WB.jpg

Without the ND1000 filter, white balanced, Custom Profile (f/11, 1/200 sec, ISO100)

i11340_DNGprofile_WB_ND1000.jpg

With the ND1000 filter, white balanced, Custom Profile (f/11, 6 sec, ISO100)

5) And another example:

i11343_DNGprofile_WB_ND1000.jpg

With the ND1000 filter, white balanced, Custom Profile (f/11, 8 sec, ISO100)


As can be seen, color shifts are rather minimal and are easily corrected in the post processing. I am rather happy with that. Thanks to Jerome for bringing this to our attention.
 
As can be seen, color shifts are rather minimal and are easily corrected in the post processing. I am rather happy with that. Thanks to Jerome for bringing this to our attention.

Hi Cem,

Indeed, the colors look quite good and they only require mild adjustments to make them even better.

I also noticed, just like with my Lee Big Stopper, that the filter produces a bit of (what looks like) light fall-off. Actually, it isn't light fall-off as we know it, but it is caused by the high density of the filter and its thickness. The corner rays have a longer/oblique path through the filter medium, which attenuates more light than the shorter path of the chief rays through the center.

So, especially for the wider angle lenses, it could be useful to dial in an additional amount of vignetting correction in the Raw converter, or use an LCC (Lens Cast Calibration) type of correction during Raw conversion.

Thanks, to Jerome and you for bringing these relatively affordable filters to our attention, and for sharing the test results. They can be useful tools, when used with taste and a bit of restraint, and are a good addition to the range of tools we can use to deliberately add a certain atmosphere to a scene.

They are challenging to use, because one needs to pre-visualize what a long exposure will look like. Focusing and exposure metering are relatively difficult as well, so it certainly requires some dedication, skill, and creativity, to take such shots while avoiding the cliché look.

But then, that's not really something new ... Many good photos require skillful work to become that good.

Cheers,
Bart
 
Just stopping by for my once every so often visit and noticed this thread. Probably because I was trying to find my 3-stop ND filter. I had taken it off to loan a friend my 85/1.2 (while he was in my home studio) because my portable studio was down while family visited (so I had a touch of extra room) and my strobes were not back up yet so he was using my LED lights, which are much faster to set up, but are about 3 stops less max power than the 1/4 power setting on my weakest strobes. I usually use the LED lights when shooting 3D stereo sets, solves the sync issue between light and cameras. (I found the ND filter BTW).

I use a Tiffen ND0.9 (3-stop) on my 85/1.2 when shooting model portfolios, because I hate spending the time changing my lights over from my other lenses' usual f5.6 to the 85/1.2's f2.0 i use with it. Also I thought the light fall off on the filter was a feature :) It actually is kind of when doing portrait head shots, at least for my style.

Anyway, kind of interested in ND filters right now, because I have been using that one for quite some time and I am thinking it may be time for a new one since being a touch of a klutz I have put my finger on it a few too many times, that and dropping it at the beach a couple of times. Just the filter, not the lens or camera. It was sunrise, with barely enough light and well that is what f1.2 and ISO800+ is for. The ND filter got in the way - need it in the studio, don't need it at the beach.

So would not mind some recommendations for a replacement 3-stop ND filter. It will be awhile before I get one, unless I drop it in the sand one too many times (it being fall now and my subjects being lightly clothed humans, probably won't be at the beach at sunrise until spring at the earliest). At least not in my location.
 

Asher Kelman

OPF Owner/Editor-in-Chief
Tim,

Why not move over to a 4x4 square Lee Filter or Cokin Filter system. That way, you can change your filters fast.

I can't imagine keeping a Big Stopper filter on my camera and then having to do a slow shutter speed just to compensate!

Asher
 
So would not mind some recommendations for a replacement 3-stop ND filter. It will be awhile before I get one, unless I drop it in the sand one too many times (it being fall now and my subjects being lightly clothed humans, probably won't be at the beach at sunrise until spring at the earliest). At least not in my location.

Hi Tim,

What a coincidence. To further reduce the power of my studio-flash units when used at shorter distances, I just purchased a 3 stop ND filter. Since I wanted to try the Haida filters because they are relatively affordable, I also purchased an ND 0.9 (3-stop, 8x), Pro II coated version.

I've recorded it's spectral transmission characteristics by measuring the spectrum of daylight (6586 k) with and without filter, and plotted the absorption of the filter expressed as Density (-Log10(transmission%) ), because I wanted to know how accurate it would match the intended 0.9 density. Here is the result:

ND09-Haida.png


It shows that there is a slightly warm response, a bit more UV and Blue density (less transmission), and a bit less Red density (more transmission), but overall it hits the 0.9 density pretty well across the visible spectrum. The slightly higher IR transmission will be compensated for by the IR-filter that covers the sensor (combined with the Optical Low-pass Filter, if present). The exact color response therefore depends on the particular camera it is used with, but it looks pretty neutral to me.

I also compared the spectral transmission, and density, of both the Lee Big Stopper and the Haida Pro II version of these 10-stop (ND 3.0, 1000x) filters. Here are the results based on the absorption characteristics of Daylight (6568 k), as a Transmission plot and as a relative Density plot:

ND3-Haida+Lee_Trans.png
ND3-Haida+Lee_Dens.png


As can be seen, the Lee filter is slightly smoother across the spectrum, but both have a similar profile which allows to correct the Whitebalance with a simple Kelvin and Tint correction. Some spectrally very pure colors may be hard to get exactly right without targeted post-processing due to the more bumpy absorption spectrum in the yellow-orange region. As always, shooting Raw-file data is preferable, also because these filters do introduce additional light fall-off towards the corners (especially on wide-angle lenses), which can be compensated for by a Flat-field compensation or Lens Cast Calibration which is best done in Linear gamma Raw before demosaicing.

The average density of my Haida Pro II ND 0.9 filter across the visible spectrum is calculated to be 0.95 (3.16 stops, 8.9x) which is pretty accurate for such a density. The Lee BigStopper is 2.51 (8.3 stops, 323x) and the Haida Pro II is 2.64 (8.8 stops, 443x), both fall a bit short of the intended 10 stops in the center of the image, so make sure to check the histogram of your image on location to avoid overexposure. Especially with wide angle lenses the images will be a bit darker in the corners, so one should try to avoid underexposure there.

Cheers,
Bart
 

Andrew Stannard

pro member
Hi,

I use the Lee filter system on my 5D MkII, including the Big Stopper, and find the whole system to be really versatile.

As noted by other the Big Stopper does produce a blue cast and some vignetting - but this is easily correctable in Lightroom, and at least the colour cast is consistent across the frame - unlike some of the cheap 10 stop filters on ebay.

There's been some talk of 'getting rich colours' from the big stopper. When this happens I think it is more of a by-product - I've noticed it evening skies, where the long exposure and movement of the clouds allows the warm colours to spread across the frame - resulting in a rich appearance.

Regards,
Andrew
 
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