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  #1  
Old December 5th, 2006, 03:22 PM
Diane Fields Diane Fields is offline
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Default Old new news---Epson 3800 shpping in US

I haven't seen this mentioned at OPF, so thought I would. the Epson 3800 is shipping in the US. Many people are on preorder lists (yours truly was) and some are quite long. What I learned is that if you are persistent you can find one in stock or ready to be drop shipped if you are wanting one before the end of the year (I was, for tax purposes).

Your best bet is to get the list of Epson wide format printer resellers in the US (I have the link if anyone needs it) and just start calling. In NC, for instance, there is only one reseller--on the other end of the state in a small city. Strange. In SC--there are 3. The printers won't show up any place but these wide format resellers until well after the end of the year it appears. It reminds me of the quest I had years ago trying to track down a Canon D60 when they first came out (and I did find one LOL).

Diane
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  #2  
Old December 5th, 2006, 04:18 PM
Asher Kelman Asher Kelman is online now
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Let's have some links.

I was looking too. BTW, BHPhotovido.com has the Canon 5000 iPF 17" competing printer with a $500 coupong to make it highly competitive!

Now which to be bought? and is the HP now out of the race?

Asher
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  #3  
Old December 5th, 2006, 04:30 PM
Ken Tanaka Ken Tanaka is offline
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Thanks for the new old news, Diane. I've generally learned not to be an early adopter but the first reports from European 3800 owners have all been very positive. So I took the leap and pre-ordered a unit (from InkJetArt --- free ground shipping). I honestly don't care if it doesn't arrive until January. My 2400 is still a prince and I have enough on my hands for the next few weeks to stave off anticipatory anxiety.

I do, however, see that Pictureline is listing the 3800 as in (low) stock at this writing.
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Old December 5th, 2006, 04:40 PM
Asher Kelman Asher Kelman is online now
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Ken, did you form an opinion on the Canon printer.

Asher
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  #5  
Old December 5th, 2006, 04:47 PM
John_Nevill John_Nevill is offline
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Well my trusty Epson 2100 is hitting 2 years old next month and i'm considering a new printer as well. I'm about 3/4 the way through a 2nd Lyson CIS inkset having previously been through a fair number of genuine cartridge sets.

Anyhow a couple of the Lyson cartridges have started to fail and won't reset. My supplier has offered to replace them FOC, but i'm now thinking do I invest in the 3800, Canon 9000 or a HP B9180. Decsions, decsions!

I could easily convert the 2100 to a quad B/W set (before it dies) for the price of the ink and grab a deal on a new printer as the $ to is favourable.

Problem is, i'm reading lots of mixed opinions on the HP (firmware issues), while the Canon 5000 is a little out of my price range. I may well wait for the new Canon 9500 pigment or just go for 3800.

I'd love to hear what others think of the 3800, A2 is appealing and this would make it my my 4th Epson (being a creature of habit).
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  #6  
Old December 5th, 2006, 05:20 PM
Diane Fields Diane Fields is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ken Tanaka
Thanks for the new old news, Diane. I've generally learned not to be an early adopter but the first reports from European 3800 owners have all been very positive. So I took the leap and pre-ordered a unit (from InkJetArt --- free ground shipping). I honestly don't care if it doesn't arrive until January. My 2400 is still a prince and I have enough on my hands for the next few weeks to stave off anticipatory anxiety.

I do, however, see that Pictureline is listing the 3800 as in (low) stock at this writing.
Here's the list http://www.epson.com/cgi-bin/Store/W...sellerList=A-C

Ken, I had a deposit at Inkjetart, but they seem to be a victim of their own popularity (well deserved AFAIK) and the list was long. I opted out and found another, but they were gracious as I expected and I will now use my deposit to order paper, etc. Since you don't care--stick with them. Samy's had some Friday and I even directed someone there who got the last actual 'in stock' one and I had some correspondence with them--they expect more soon. Several small resellers (mine in NC is so small I never heard of them LOL--and the 2 closer ones in SC are both not really retail either--closed on weekends) seem to have a few left because nobody knows about them. On dpreview, 2 were mentioned (probably gone now) with 3 and 5 in stock.

Jack Flesher, who I expect is relatively fussy about his prints, has a nice little review on the 3800. He bought it to complement his 7800---and to print his Mk prints (I asked him directly why he bought it) http://luminous-landscape.com/forum/...howtopic=13404

All the reports so far are as I expected. I'm hoping to have mine by the first of the week at the latest. My 2200 will be put to experimental printinng (fabric, odd substrates, etc.---a whole different ballgame).

Diane
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  #7  
Old December 5th, 2006, 05:52 PM
Ken Tanaka Ken Tanaka is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Asher Kelman
Ken, did you form an opinion on the Canon printer.

Asher
I have not. I've read some reviews of it and it looks promising. I suspect, however, that Canon's development will have to proceed through some of the little bumps that Epson has long since overcome, perhaps quickly.

I never wavered on sticking with Epson. I've used their printers since the 2000P (a rather painful early model). With paper manufacturers now widely offering Epson K3 profiles for their products, and with less than no desire to build custom profiles, the 3800 was a no-brainer for me. I'd love to have a larger Epson but I really do not have the space for it and would not need such large sized prints often. The 3800's ability to handle up to 17" and it's smaller (than a 4800) footprint are perfect characteristics for my needs.
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  #8  
Old December 7th, 2006, 01:26 PM
Ken Tanaka Ken Tanaka is offline
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I discovered yesterday that I am #95 in line for a 3800 at InkJetArt. I placed a full order for the printer about 6 days ago. They indicated that they expect a shipment of 17 sometime within the next week. So, let's see, at this rate...multiply by 0.6...divide by the standard factor of probability of 0.8672...seasonally adjust for Christmas shipping demands...now multiply by the square root of 2.06....I should see my 3800 sometime around the next PMA (when the 3900 will probably be announced).

As I noted, it's not a real issue for me but this may provide others with some guidance for placing a 3800 order now.
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  #9  
Old December 7th, 2006, 01:33 PM
Asher Kelman Asher Kelman is online now
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ken Tanaka
I discovered yesterday that I am #95 in line for a 3800 at InkJetArt. ..................

.I should see my 3800 sometime around the next PMA (when the 3900 will probably be announced).

As I noted, it's not a real issue for me but this may provide others with some guidance for placing a 3800 order now.
Well then, the Canon 5000 iPF 17" competing printer seems to have improved!

Asher
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  #10  
Old December 7th, 2006, 01:40 PM
Diane Fields Diane Fields is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ken Tanaka
I discovered yesterday that I am #95 in line for a 3800 at InkJetArt. I placed a full order for the printer about 6 days ago. They indicated that they expect a shipment of 17 sometime within the next week. So, let's see, at this rate...multiply by 0.6...divide by the standard factor of probability of 0.8672...seasonally adjust for Christmas shipping demands...now multiply by the square root of 2.06....I should see my 3800 sometime around the next PMA (when the 3900 will probably be announced).

As I noted, it's not a real issue for me but this may provide others with some guidance for placing a 3800 order now.
LOL Ken, I did rescind my order at IJA as I stated. They were fine about it---maybe glad that a few of us did. There are a number of 3800's around--not just allocated for them it seems (it honestly looks as though they had the most orders of anyone--possibly because they are relatively well known, their tech is on dpreview where he is very helpful and knowledgable but also did a hands on review with photos to boot and I think that got the attention of a number of folks who didn't know where to get on a list. For instance---here in NC--there is one Epson wide format printer dealer--so I was looking at all the likely possibilities that I knew and IJA was right up there since I buy other things from them. )

Mine is on its way and should be here the first of the week. Now I have to get some larger format media as the largest I have in house is 13 x 19---and I really do want to see the first large one roll out of there LOL.

Diane
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  #11  
Old December 7th, 2006, 01:45 PM
Asher Kelman Asher Kelman is online now
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Diane or anyone else, do you know if one can cut a longer sheet and hand feed it into the 3800 since it doesn't take rolls? One could simply enter the size as a custom sheet?

In any case, what is the longest sheet that can be purchased already cut for the 3800?

Asher
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  #12  
Old December 7th, 2006, 04:06 PM
Diane Fields Diane Fields is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Asher Kelman
Diane or anyone else, do you know if one can cut a longer sheet and hand feed it into the 3800 since it doesn't take rolls? One could simply enter the size as a custom sheet?

In any case, what is the longest sheet that can be purchased already cut for the 3800?

Asher
Yes, I know for sure that you can do that---I'll post the link to 'Chris the tech's' hands on review at IJA who has photos of himself with his handcut 17" x 35" paper ready to be printed.

The limit that we know of is 35 1/4" --which means for long pano printers that this may not be the printer for them. I 'very' occasionally process a 3 panel flat shift pano form my 45 TSE--but I've yet to print one. However--if I did--that's plenty long enough for me--just not for the diehard pano shooters I'm afraid.

The longest sheet you can buy PERIOD for a 17" printer is 22" (that I'm aware of and I've sure looked at most all the paper mfg. sites). However, I already inquired and you can have sheets cut to order (and relatively reasonably at RR) at both IJA (I have no price there) and Red River. BTW--Epson does not do a 17" roll so you will have to go to a 3rd party paper for roll to be cut to 17" by.....

Here's the link---its probably worthwhile to read it and look at the graphics (driver, log, picture of a 16 x 24 from cut sheet and Chris holding a 17 x 37 as it feeds) Its short--but you'll get a feel for what to expect.
http://inkjetart.com/3800/report/index.html

I wanted to add that I do plan to handcut sheets. I have a small job (shooting tomorrow morning) that requires either 16 x 20 or 16 x 24 mono prints (my decision on the size). I may buy a rotary cutter--B & H has a nice discount on the Rotatrims right now--but I do have tools (my husband's sizeable T square, rotary hand cutter, cutting board, etc.)

Diane
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  #13  
Old December 7th, 2006, 04:16 PM
Asher Kelman Asher Kelman is online now
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Thanks Diane for the links on the paper. That then clears one thing up!

Do you have any special preference from experience for the rotatrims or this is just a good price?

Asher
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  #14  
Old December 7th, 2006, 04:49 PM
Diane Fields Diane Fields is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Asher Kelman
Thanks Diane for the links on the paper. That then clears one thing up!

Do you have any special preference from experience for the rotatrims or this is just a good price?

Asher
No, and I admit I'd rather buy a less expensive one (and may). This one just seems to be the most highly regarded one over and over and over--ad nauseum. There are also the Dahl's, Carl's and Kodak (which seems to be a rebadged Rotatrim--or so several have said). It was one more thing to research--I've never even considered buying a rotary trimmer before--but there sure are opinions about them LOL.

Diane
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  #15  
Old December 7th, 2006, 11:43 PM
Eric Hiss Eric Hiss is offline
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Default Rototrims

I've got two of these beasts...a 48" and a 24". They seem expensive at first but they are pretty impressive. Did you know you can cut aluminum sheet with them? How about matte board (well 4 ply is no problem)? I actually have a keen cut for matte board and foam core but the rototrims are pretty nice. You can find like 30 year old ones floating around and they still work fine. I've had others before and got tired of changing blades and sh*tty cuts.
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  #16  
Old December 7th, 2006, 11:46 PM
Eric Hiss Eric Hiss is offline
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Default 3800's

My dealer told me that he only got about 20% of the allocation he was expecting on the 3800... I was near the top of the list but didn't get mine. Since I've sold my 4000 and won't have a printer he's recommending I look at the Canon ipf 5000 which he can sell me at nearly the same price as the 3800. Anyone have any thoughts on this? Should I wait for the 38?
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  #17  
Old December 8th, 2006, 12:15 AM
Asher Kelman Asher Kelman is online now
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Read Michael Reichman's report on the Canon ipf 5000. It got the highest marks.

Asher

Last edited by Asher Kelman; December 14th, 2006 at 12:22 AM.
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  #18  
Old December 8th, 2006, 06:16 AM
Diane Fields Diane Fields is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Eric Hiss
My dealer told me that he only got about 20% of the allocation he was expecting on the 3800... I was near the top of the list but didn't get mine. Since I've sold my 4000 and won't have a printer he's recommending I look at the Canon ipf 5000 which he can sell me at nearly the same price as the 3800. Anyone have any thoughts on this? Should I wait for the 38?
Eric
They both appear to be excellent printers but I feel the 3800 fits a particular niche. If you don't need what the 3800 offers, then I'd consider both. There are also a lot of 3800's around if that's the one that suits your needs better.

Diane
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Old December 9th, 2006, 01:29 AM
Eric Hiss Eric Hiss is offline
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Default hp 3100

My dealer is also saying HP says they will start shipping the z3100 in a few weeks. I had heard earlier that these wouldn't be available until 2nd quarter 2007 so this puts a little twist into the mix. I had considered the 3800 mostly because I print from sheet most of the time and not roll and also that I would like to have a pinter that could do postcards and smaller prints. I think the 3800 is the only one that prints 17x22 and 4x6. But I don't really need to print small and the HP's look impressive with the 12 inks and spectophotometer. Guess I am going to wait a few weeks and see what's shipping then. I have to admit that while I have been a long time epson user, I have been really frustrated with the 4000 with a whole lot of user interface things and the constant ink usage. Everytime i turn it on, it sucks ink and wastes paper. There were times when I had to get prints ready for a show when it woudl constantly come up with problems with paper feed issues, not finishing prints or whatever that I wanted to bash it to bits with a sledge hammer. I've not had these problems with the epson 7600 but it also wasted paper and ink. So I am pretty reluctant to go in for a new epson if there are alternatives. If the HP isn't shipping by early Jan then I'll probably try the Canon.
Eric
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  #20  
Old December 13th, 2006, 09:04 PM
Ken Tanaka Ken Tanaka is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ken Tanaka
I discovered yesterday that I am #95 in line for a 3800 at InkJetArt. I placed a full order for the printer about 6 days ago.
I was informed today that I am now #67 in line for a 3800. I don't think I'll begin clearing a spot for it just yet, however. InkJetArt has no idea when they'll receive another shipment.
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Old December 13th, 2006, 09:44 PM
Don Lashier Don Lashier is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ken Tanaka
I was informed today that I am now #67 in line for a 3800. I don't think I'll begin clearing a spot for it just yet, however. InkJetArt has no idea when they'll receive another shipment.
Samy's posted at LL today that they just got more in if anyone's looking.

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  #22  
Old December 13th, 2006, 10:23 PM
Diane Fields Diane Fields is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Don Lashier
Samy's posted at LL today that they just got more in if anyone's looking.

- DL
And Pictureline can probably ship one or have one drop shipped to you pretty quickly too. That's who I got mine from in the end. IJA still has a very long waiting list and I opted out, am taking my deposit in paper and ordered from Pictureline. I'm printing with it now (actually evaluating the 'new glossies'---Hahnemuhle's Fine ARt Pearl, Crane Museo's Silver Rag and my winner'---Innova Semi Matte. (tried Innova warm tone FType gloss too).

I love the printer---am printing, as Jack Flesher and Andrew Rodney told me I would---WYSIWYG for toned monos (no RIP, no ABW).

Diane
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  #23  
Old December 14th, 2006, 12:23 AM
Asher Kelman Asher Kelman is online now
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Diane,

How long have you had it now? I thought you were still waiting, LOL!

Oh, what is ABW?

Asher
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  #24  
Old December 14th, 2006, 06:33 AM
Diane Fields Diane Fields is offline
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I received it Tuesday. ABW is Advanced Black and White. You enter it in the driver dialog (same as the other Epson K3 ink printers). You turn off color managent and and use no profiles--thus letting the printer/driver handle the mono printing. I was told--and have found---that I can get excellent mono prints using color managment and printing without using ABW. Others may find they prefer ABW.

Diane

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Old December 14th, 2006, 11:43 AM
Ken Tanaka Ken Tanaka is offline
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Yes, it looks like IJA is the laggard of the 3800 resellers. But since I am in no particular hurry to get the unit IJA's free ground shipping offer represents a notable savings over the $40-$50+ ground shipping charges that Pictureline and Samy's are levying.
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  #26  
Old December 15th, 2006, 06:14 AM
Tim Smith Tim Smith is offline
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Default A question on the 3800

If you don't mind, I'd like to insert a question into this thread. I've been re-entering photography since October and have thus far managed to cover my needs on the capture side of the equation, but have nothing on the output side. In fact, I had never even seen a print generated from a high-end printer until I attended a John Paul Caponigro workshop last week here in Maine. JP is a big Epson fan and trusts their profiles out of the box. Good enough for me, so I've decided on the 3800 as my first printer.

My question to you is what additional items/supplies should I plan on ordering along with the printer? My understanding is that the paper supplied with the printer won't amount to much, so I've anticipated I'll need some. But how about ink? Does it make sense to order a complete set of new ink as a backup? Is there a "best if sold by" date on ink?

My goal is to (once ordered and delivered) have a good amount of time to experiment with the printer before having to order supplies and wait around until they are delivered. Any suggestions for a first-time printer buyer would be appreciated.

Thanks!
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Old December 15th, 2006, 06:38 AM
Diane Fields Diane Fields is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tim Smith
If you don't mind, I'd like to insert a question into this thread. I've been re-entering photography since October and have thus far managed to cover my needs on the capture side of the equation, but have nothing on the output side. In fact, I had never even seen a print generated from a high-end printer until I attended a John Paul Caponigro workshop last week here in Maine. JP is a big Epson fan and trusts their profiles out of the box. Good enough for me, so I've decided on the 3800 as my first printer.

My question to you is what additional items/supplies should I plan on ordering along with the printer? My understanding is that the paper supplied with the printer won't amount to much, so I've anticipated I'll need some. But how about ink? Does it make sense to order a complete set of new ink as a backup? Is there a "best if sold by" date on ink?

My goal is to (once ordered and delivered) have a good amount of time to experiment with the printer before having to order supplies and wait around until they are delivered. Any suggestions for a first-time printer buyer would be appreciated.

Thanks!
Tim, be sure and order a USB cable if you plan to hook by USB and don't have an extra.

Consider what sizes you plan to print--esp. at first. The ink supply is gracious and I didn't order any extra yet---I've done a lot of 8.5 x 11, several 13 x 19 and 1 11.17 so far (LOTS of 8 x 10's LOL---I've been sampling papers as I have with each printer I've bought in the last number of years). I'm waiting for my roll paper and 17 x 22 sheet--I just can't wait to print the first larger than13 x 19 print LOL. Unless you are going to print a huge amount of the largest prints immediately, you will be fine with the ink for a fair amount of time. I don't think you will have trouble findng ink shortly. My understanding is that Pictureline has the ink at the best price around now---and in stock, but Atlex.com has been my ink supplier for a good while now with the best prices and VERY fast delivery (they are in FL and I'm in NC) though they don't have any 3800 carts in stock yet. You will be able to get ink I feel sure so probably no need to stock up. The carts (mine are all in the printer now) I think have 2 year dates on them--'on the shelf' and Epson recommends using the carts in the printer within 6 months. Many have had their inks in other printers (pigment) longer than that, so I wouldn't worry.

You will need paper. I recommend buying sample packs since you are a new printer. The choices out there are vast now. Inkjetart offers a lot of sample packs of various papers--including Epson papers I think. Shades of Paper has a number of sample packs---be sure and try their new 'glossy' pack which has the fiber glossy 'darkroom' style papers. If you want to do fineart prints (I would bet you might if you like John Paul's work), then you will want to get some Hahnemuehle, Innova, Crane Museo, Ilford, etc. sample packs from someone. Don't overlook Red River papers either. Maybe even Hawk Mt. If you are thinking of doing prints over 20 inches---then you will have to consider roll paper and then---how you will handcut the sheets and what tools you might need for that.

So---there are a lot of things to consider, but I would say---a cable if you are not going to network the printer, sample packs of paper---and you are good to go. The paper that comes with the printer is premium luster and the bag states its for 'alignment during installation'. There are 10 sheets and it only took one for me---so that's 9 to play with, but not a lot---and very limiting as to what you can print--that's why I suggest the sample packs.

You will love the output. I have a big table full of fineart, luster and F-type samples (mostly mono prints--I use the same image file on all--the easiest way to judge, but often some papers will lend themselves better to one image than another).

Any questions, feel free to ask. There are many here that have been printing with inkjets for years---and with pigmented printers for quite a good lengthe of time also.

Ah, i forgot the 'how' part. Since you took the workshop, I'm assuming you are familiar with color management, Photoshop and calibration. If not---those are good things to research and learn more about.

Diane
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Old December 15th, 2006, 07:15 AM
Tim Smith Tim Smith is offline
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Thank you Diane! You've given me some excellent tips and resources. I hadn't considered the sample pack route but will look into it further. It's very nice to hear that the ink will last for a bit, especially since it can be a bit expensive.

I'm good to go with the calibration and color management end since my design work has required me to keep that well tuned. I'm sure there will be some tweaks for photo printing, but I'm confident (easy to say now, in the abstract) that I can make the adjustment.

I've been thinking of purchasing the postscript RIP version of the 3800 since it's conceivable that i might wish to use the printer as a proofing device for layouts that include text, etc. Does that sound worthwhile or is there another RIP software out there that would give me the postscript interpretation and maybe add some other bells and whistles?

Again, thanks for your help!
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Old December 15th, 2006, 08:39 AM
Diane Fields Diane Fields is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tim Smith
I've been thinking of purchasing the postscript RIP version of the 3800 since it's conceivable that i might wish to use the printer as a proofing device for layouts that include text, etc. Does that sound worthwhile or is there another RIP software out there that would give me the postscript interpretation and maybe add some other bells and whistles?

Again, thanks for your help!
Tim, there is a thread on LL (Luminous Landscapes) in the printing forum that discusses the RIP---I believe the suggestion is that you would spend your money better on the 'full' RIP. I don't need a RIP for that purpose, so didn't consider it, but Ken, at Pictureline, told me that it could be added at a later date. I'd check that though. In any case, he did tell me that 'they' would not receive any of the RIP version until the end of January.

Sounds like you are set. The sample packs will save you a lot of money. For instance, I had heard great things about the Hahnemuhle F Type paper (Fine Art Pearl). I wasn't sure I would like any of them, but since there's been so much 'HOO HA" about these papers I thought I should at least try them. After testing, letting them sit overnight---I found that the Innova paper (the semi matte now called F White Satin) was my favorite--and is actually a paper I will buy in some size and quatity. Saved myself on that one. Then---there are now SO many great papers out there, you may easily find some that meet your 'vision' better than others.

Diane
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  #30  
Old December 15th, 2006, 09:21 AM
Tim Smith Tim Smith is offline
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Holy Guacamole. I just did a quick scan for Image Print and Colorburst RIPs. Kind of a big ticket for the few times I might need to proof a layout prior to offset. I think I'll table that idea until next year and I've had time to work with my new printer for awhile. As it is, I'm teetering on the hairy edge of info overload.

Cheers!
Tim
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Posting images or text grants license to OPF, yet of such remain with its creator. Still, all assembled discussion 2006-2017 Asher Kelman (all rights reserved) Posts with new theme or unusual image might be moved/copied to a new thread!