Getting Started in Real Estate/Architectural Photography

Hello All,

Sorry to interrupt the flow with a beginner "how to" question, but I am just starting to get into the real-estate-photography-for-hire world and I want to make sure I start off right. I have been working in the field for about two years now at my current employer, but photography is not the main focus of my job by any stretch. The company supplies a functioning camera, I go to people's houses and take 10 minutes worth of pictures.

But I really enjoy that aspect of my job, and I'd like to try and do it on a freelance basis for other real estate agents/home builders in my area (Raleigh-Durham-Chapel Hill NC) and I am a little clueless as to the best way to proceed. Since I don't have much of a portfolio yet (the images I have from the company camera are not stellar), I don't feel comfortable making up a price off the top of my head, and I honestly don't know what to say/how to pitch my services. Any thoughts on the subject would be GREATLY appreciated!

PS-I have minimal equipment of my own, but I have found it sufficient when shooting some model homes before. Nikon D50 with 18-55 DX lens, SB600 flash and a nice tripod. I don't have the funds to jump into a lot of lighting equipment right now...

thanks a bunch,

Sarah

Sarah, hallo

it's not really clear (to me) if your goal is to become a architecture photographer, or "taking 10 min worth of pictures". See, these are two different beasts; here in old Europe the gap between these is threated as being two different "languages" ; they require different equipment as well. So please specify your personal interest.

Sarah,

First you need a goal. What section of the market are you after and how much time can you give it and what do you expect to earn? Who is the competition? How big is the pie? What can you uniquely bring to clients to make you competitive?

O.K., now write out a draft business plan! Show it to others to criticize and be realistic!

Your job is to now build your portfolio for your new job. When you take pics for your current employer, take more pics with the idea that you will use them for your portfolio.

Make sure that your contract with your employer does not make you lose your © to the images. Type out a release for your boss and the home owner.

You need a great wide angle lens. I'd suggest the Canon Digital Rebel with the wide angle zoom lens.

Make sure you are always orthogonal.

Collect room shots, fireplace pics, garden shots, street view, gardens and so forth.

Visit museums and other beautiful public buildings and set up a tripod in a street and shoot carefully in different lights to get perfect pics from different angles.

Use an architecture magazine as a guide to stlye and also the real estate listing books and online galleries of big real estate agents.

You needs to be able to take any of those shots with competency.

Just make a list of every category of image you want. Print out sample pics and make a printed 3 ring binder with all the images you are proud of by category.

If it wont print out perfectly, reprocess it or discard.

When you have made a dozen examples for each of your chosen categories, now select the best and put together your portfolio.

Now you need business cards, a website and a marketing plan...and good fortune!

Now this does not make you an architecture photographer yet, but will get you started with buildings and and help you develop a style. After that I'd suggest coursework and being an asisstant to an established architectural photographer.

Asher

In addition to what Asher said...

• Dual-axis bubble level ($5..$25)
• Good set of Neutral Density filters for the "crowd control" and same of Polarizer filters for the reflection control (each can be anywhere between $50 and $300)
• Tilt-Shift lens for the keystoning control (those are expensive even used, around $1K)
• WA lens is good, but if you are serious about your future job you need a FF body (also not cheap, around $2.5K used)

HTH & Good Luck!

Great tips Nikolai!

I know why you mentioned "Crowd Control". A very good term for getting rid of the people that cross in front of the great building you are shooting.

If you shoot at a fast speed, then the people will be caught too in your picture and so ruin it!

The neutral density filter allows you to have a really long shutter speed so that the people are not exposed sufficiently but the building is.

You cannot, of course have a rush our mass of people and cars vanish!

You will get a grey/brown blur over the ower part of your building.

This is for the times when there are gaps between the people or cars!

There will be Canon 5D used cameras available in 6-10 months I expect, so you might get the fullframe camera for about $1200-$1700 within that time as people imagine a date of new releases and start to unload existing DSLR bodies in advance.

Asher

Asher,

thank you for decyphering my brief post

I surely hope that there will be some used 5D bodies in that price range at that time. I'm still uncertain which 2d body to get - another 30d or a 5D. Both have pros and cons in my case... I'm trying not to think of it now and keep it cool untill the moment I will be *really* ready for it

Cheers!

I agree with you, Asher and Nikolai, adding another aspect:

The most important is to get the feeling, the "sensitivity" for rooms, spaces, materiality and its light; the sun's light-quality, it changes all the time. To get control and experience on perspective, the eye-, aka camera position, the lens angle and its best use, etc.

This is the required "substance" for good architecture shots. You can do this training with your actual camera as well. And then you can decide, if this is what you' re looking for...

Proposal: Chose a building you like, and take a lot of shots, from all angles, in different light situations. Judge them; you'll see yourself and - more important - make the experience yourself, which shots are keepers, which one might be deleted. This is for getting the initial rules; these might be broken, once you know what you do.

One example?



usually, for architecture shots - people think in the wide angles, only. This shot shows the use of a tele. (100 mm on FF) It does concentrate the 7 buildings in one single picture, and shows them in a contextual view. (The new houses, on the left, have their position in function of the existing, older houses, on the right side.) With a wide, its impossible to show such a contextual view in a concentrate way.

Telephotos and Zooms frame/crop and devote more pixels to the subject of interest.

Michael Fontana said:

I agree with you, Asher and Nikolai, adding another aspect:

The most important is to get the feeling, the "sensitivity" for rooms, spaces, materiality and its light; the sun's light-quality, it changes all the time. To get control and experience on perspective, the eye-, aka camera position, the lens angle and its best use, etc.

One example?

usually, for architecture shots - people think in the wide angles, only. This shot shows the use of a tele. (100 mm on FF) It does concentrate the 7 buildings in one single picture, and shows them in a contextual view. (The new houses, on the left, have their position in function of the existing, older houses, on the right side.) With a wide, its impossible to show such a contextual view in a concentrate way.

Click to expand...

Hi Michael,

At first blush, you are correct.

This thread covers esthetics, focus of attention and a technical issue.

Although, for sure, these are second nature to you, to get "the look" you refer to, one has, in reality, more freedom sometimes in lens choice than it might first appear.

So for the sake of the orginal question and making this thread more complete, allow me to go over some points which come from this particular statement.

The "look" of a photograph is defined, of course by many things.

Subject, context, lighting, color palette and use, contrast, what's there and not there and how what's seen and not seen are arranged. There's more of course.

The zoom, in this case, crops for us. The perspective is defined by camera position only. The experience in viewing is influenced by the difference between the viewing angle of the lens any building and the viewing angle when we look at the print.

Depth of field will depend on aperture and the focal length, yes that's true. However, given that is equalized, the look of the telephoto can be reproduced in this case by a wide angle with with sufficent resolution (lens and sensor).

Ultimately, the telephoto, or better a zoom, allows creative framing to be done on location.

A wide angle, covering more than the subject, requires cropping in one's workflow.

There are two questions. (Given one has chosen one's position to have the desired angle and perspective.)

1. Does the camera with the wider angle lens have sufficent resolution so that a crop you want will be have the detail you need. If not one needs a longer lens.

2. Does the telephoto, from the same position frame our chosen subject and exclude what we don't want? If not, one needs a zoom or a different focal length prime.

Ultimately, telephotos and zooms frame/crop and devote more pixels to the subject of interest. Wider angles can be cropped to get the same effect, given one does not run out of detail!

Asher

i shoot real estate for a living, and i have a few thoughts on the matter

Marketing:
work backwards, sounds weird doesnt it, but if you check out the advertising copy of agencies in your area you will quickly get a grasp of how bad they can be. Often they take their own photos, but where they have a photographer, it will depend on functions like punctuality, reliability, diplomacy. appearance, as well as the ability to create images they think they need. That is, they will represent a certain style, and a particular market, mostly they wont want that to change. Work up a portfolio of prints and compare them with images from net based real estate imagery.

Equipment:
I see recommended dSLRs, which is fine but, three of my most important clients use a web interface for internet tours, which has the peculiar problem that it will only accept 4x3 framed images. If you place a 3x2 image from a more usual dSLR it compresses it to fit its frame. Therefor all your 3x2 images need to be cropped, not resized to 4x3 to suit that interface. If your office gets busy, you may find you are cropping 60 to 120 images a day.

As a result, I use a point and shoot Panasonic LC1, and an Olympus E300 for shooting as both are 4x3 frame. The Olympus has an 11-22mm wide zoom, and the LC1 a 23mm wide converter. You require 24mm at least for interiors, longer than that is pretty well useless. You almost need two of everything to cover instances of breakdowns. You will also need powerful TTL flash or good competency in flash technique. I have a Metz 54 with adapters for Leica and Olympus cameras and an Olympus FL36 flash. The problem is you need to balance outside light with the interior light, and be able to shoot across rooms perhaps exceeding 20ft. Without this, you cannot demonstrate views through windows, or the beauty of the garden views from inside the home. Get plenty of smaller memory cards (1 for each job) and batteries galore.

Time management:
I work quickly, and this is appreciated by both clients and agents. I dont have time for tripods etc as I work freehand and try as many viewpoints as I can for major rooms. Experimenting a little is fine but a set repertoire is quicker to work with. Remember that not all of the clients will enjoy getting their homes photographed, thats why I work fast, but it helps boost my hourly rate as well. Always be on time, always have cell numbers etc of all your contacts handy. make sure you have enough time gaps between jobs. I can get through an average house in 30-45 minutes, and I will spend an hour or so PP to square up the walls with the sides of photos and balance the light through a series of images. If I spend 5 minutes on an image PP its probably 3 minutes too long, but it happens.

Special conditions:
You need to develop set plans to technically solve some common but troublesome shooting situations. First is as mentioned balancing flash + tungsten lights and outdoor sources. Generally I subdue flash at -2/3 stop, which presents an interesting and colourful mix of light sources, not overpowered by flash which looks rather flat.

Shooting uphill.
On occasion a house is uphill along a steep driveway. Without a viewpoint across the street it can be difficult to get a worthwhile image of a critical view of the home. I use a sectioned pole with a tripod ball mount on the top which enables me to locate a camera on top, and fire the shutter via a remote release. It can be extended to 20ft high, and Ive had it up there a few times. With PP you can straighten the verticals just as you should for walls in interiors etc, so things appear to straight and level.

Shooting upsun:
There is sometimes the need to shoot up into the sun, because with time constraints you either dont want to travel back there at a better time or, your agent needs the copy fast. So to accomplish this I put the camera on a tripod, use an exposure for sky, and another for shadow, and merge the images together with a plugin called photomatix. This allows a more complete range of stops so the image doesnt appear blown out the sky and perhaps the roof detail. other way out is fill flash, but its never worked that well for me.

I dont work for art, I work for a living, but there is art in my work I just dont have time to prat around with slow techniques and imagery that wont in the end be appreciated.

Riley

Asher, good morning

I very rarely crop in post, apart from flatstitching, etc.
The reason is, that I deliver all in A-3/300 dpi's to the client, allowing him to cover a magazine's double page (2 x A-4)

The final image is "seen, with the inner eye" when standing at the location, before framing the picture. That was the point about the >feeling, the "sensitivity" for rooms, space....< There might be some minor adjustements, when looking through the camera's viewer. This "feeling" doesn't works for 100%; rarely, but sometimes, one prefers a other image, in front of the computer display.

Today, in digital age, it's much easier to shot some 15 images, 10 beeing delivered to the client, and the selection can be made at the computer display - before post.

Another point: All images together make the "concert", blue-sky-shots usually don't fit very well beside some rainy, cloudy images, talking about the same building.

Off course, I agree on the perspective beeing defined by the camera's position, only.
BTW: the added image was a example only, for a use of a tele, within architecture photography.


Rob:
I'm very glad, you jumped in; and showed to Sarah a very different approach.
She's got to choose, now; you discribed your job much better, than I ever could.

You're spending 3 min on post, meanwhile it's usually 1 h, here.....

welcome Michael

mine is more of a mass market service, if thats not already obvious
I would take 30 - 50 images on a shoot, I have shot as many as 100+ a few times
they will use around 15 - 22 on a tour and for brochures

on sky. we all get rainy days
but you can exchange a Grey sky for a blue one
i use paint shop pro for this because its very quick
the colour relacer tool will paint gradients in
so you create a template blue colour gradient lighter toward the middle
and just replace the grey

"if thats not already obvious "

It is obvious ;-)

I'm shooting much less (from tripod, etc) - getting keepers rates (RAWS beeing edited, and delivered to the client) about 90%.

Cloud and sun:

I don't believe in software, for that, as the contrast on the buildings themself is different, too. These two shots (RAW-previews only) were taken from the same camera position; within 1/2 hour; for my taste - a big difference, if you look at the building's windows, locanda, etc.



Rob, how do you handle the copyright?

"Rob, how do you handle the copyright?"

Oh boy now I'm really going to appear nonchalant

The fireside chat when we begin a business relationship includes a speech on copyright.
The copyright belongs to me, but I have few reservations on what they use an image for.
Common usage is newsprint, brochures, and internet billboard

the caveats I do have, forbid them to forward those images to any other agency
and forbid the property owner (who may if they ask receive a copy) from doing the same
and they cannot recycle images for other diverse contributions like annual reports etc
which pretty well just inhibits the transfer of use rights between parties and purposes.

On writing this, I'm thinking a review of these circumstances might be in order
but I must say that, without exception, everyone has complied.
and this is after all a more rural location, where a bit of give and take is accepted as good business practice.
indeed, I have done photo editing which is purely for their personal use on the same basis
sometimes Im payed, where they offer, sometimes I offer and am not payed

rule of life, lets make it fun

Riley

Thanks Rob. Good, practical pointers.
AE

Rob,

Thanks so much for the practical tips! I have gotten great feedback on this thread from everyone involved. To answer the question that somebody asked with regard to whether I want to keep doing the quick 'walk-through' type of real estate photography vs. the artistic architectural side, I guess I'm looking to fall somewhere in the middle for now. Eventually I would like to do editorial work, but for the moment, Real Estate Marketing/Photography is where I'd like to be.

Do you (or anybody else!) have any advice about how to approach that field? I have made a list of agencies and home builders in my area that I could contact who I know use photography (and not very pretty photography...) on their websites, but I don't know how to go about marketing my services to them. At the moment I would be willing to do some free/price-reduced work just to build up my portfolio.

Any ideas/thoughts on the pricing/marketing myself subject?

Thanks!

most of my work is via agents
pretty much all the good agents i have are via word or mouth, thats the news they really trust
i knocked on doors and left business cards, had one or two bites but it was slow
when i began to get work it got easier
what they really want to see is your track record

then i got hooked up with a busy agent who had the following attributes
sharp business appearance
a place on the web, local newspapers
didnt skimp on advertising, positively flaunted it
charged his clients for it too, and they seem to love it
thats a very busy office and gives me 1/3 of my income

what they like about me is Im quick
I do the job quick, Im the least inconvenience to everyone else
and they get there photos the very next day, almost always
that means i shoot in the afternoons, and i do the processing in the evening
I maintain the relationship with my agents with a friendly
Im friendly, polite, i dont get personally involved with anyone at work
but Im around if they have a problem with images of any sort (not from me)

tools you need outside of photography
you need to be contactable by email/cell/home
you need reliable wheels
you need business cards
you need dress well, and maintain your appearance
particular attention when chasing work

the other suggestions are good too
a portfolio is a good idea &/or a place on the web with work they can see
they dont need to know whether you were payed or not,
that can be an entry point were it will seem you have a track record, but dont tell any lies to maintain that facade, be tactful
in fact, anything you have done in photography is important to include
but it better if its just good quality, with a smattering of WOW!

you could advertise if its economic
look for associations they commonly belong too
associations have regular journals/magazines/newsletters
seek out opportunities to advertise there, and door knock in a timely fashion to follow up
emailing for work can be useful too, emails are usually vetted by reception
as receptionists are the ones who actually call people with work
if/when they get tired of inattentive contractors they might be persuaded to call you

you could also advertise in the same media and in the same part they advertise in
if you are more rurally located this is easier to swing
you could also prepare brochures
better if theyre glossy, with your best work on them, well presented
your action plan might be the journal, the newsprint, a brochure by mail, and email, with a visit
the more you are in there face (not in an intimidating way) the better your chances

charges in the end should be related to the cost of your time but
you have a duty to present a good price, a competitive price
if you hear of other real estate photographers around
cold call them, even pose as an agent, but find out what they charge
receptionists at agents can be good for that too, chit chat
base your price in between, never be the cheapest or most expensive
cheap is cheap for a reason, so we think
btw: price has nothing to do with cost, it is what the market will pay
but base what time you will spend on it around that

ok Ive just about wrote a dam book, but im happy to answer more questions, if and when you have them

Riley

my 2 cents

I came to architecture and interior photography through my passion for design, having studied industrial design. I also have a good understanding of how things are build, from my experience of building 4 odd houses and a few hundred pieces of furniture. So with my passion for design and my knowedge of building I can have a half decent inteligent conversation with many architects.

In the beginning I actually got more jobs through understanding the architecture and the architect than my understanding of really good technical photography. Each client wants to feel confident in that you are going to portray his work well and understanding the design and being able to talk to architects and designers about it, took me half way.

The other half consisted of always putting money second and the project first. I would bend over backwards to satisfy the client, I still do. I never asked for deposits and always told them they did not have to pay me if in the end if they did not liked what I did. Sofar every client has paid me in full and from only one I have accepted a deposit since we were on different continents.

In the beginning I spend much time photographing buildings I liked, mostly contemporary modern
buildings. So it is no wonder that now most of my clients work in a similar style. I think your subject and personal style of photographing have to be some what consistant, actually a lot. Sometimes I see portfolios with such mismatched styles that I can imagine an architect looking at it and wondering what the photographer has in mind.

Then of course the tools.
To start off with a point and shoot and to end up with a Hasselblad can go a lot quicker than you think, I can attest to that. It's not what you shoot with, it's how you do it, which angles, lighting conditions etc etc. See what works for you to satisfy your client. Never take on a job that goes over your head. Taylor your tool to the shoot; to do a real estate with a point and shoot is fine, for more refined work, of course use more refined tools.

best of luck
Marc

very beautyfull work on your page marc....
my history has been in some points similar.
i am music composer from my profession, i wrote music for films many many years, got rid of television work and tried to make my hobby, photography, to my work also... not expecting much from this idea. i shot many buidlings i liked... and found very fast work which improved constantly although the market in germany is not easy at the moment. since years i only work in photgraphy and like it very much.

i started late to photgraph. at first with a $5 one way camera... after four weeks i had a twin eye mamiyaflex...... i started with 4x5" when i begun also to shoot architecture and design....

i was very skilled in technical and computer work from music productions, where the digital jump happened in the 80/90s. so fast i got a drumscanner and digital cameras as well ( fuji s2 was the first ).

as marc says, i allways put the project at first... i hate daily rates and prefer to work on lumpsum base cause it gives me more freedom to do what seems to be nessesary for me and for the project.