arTec unpacking video? Yes!

As said before the Sinar arTec arrived some days ago as I was on the road…

After a good sleep, I could not resist to open the box, but Romain was there with his HD video camera…

If you're curious or just want to share my emotion… it's there

This is so exciting. I'm impressed by the apparent lightness of the instrument and how the pieces just lock in place with perfect ease and seemingly precision too. I notice that one can move the eyepiece lens axis around some center. What is that point the movement is centered on? Is it the front of the lens or lined up with the camera itself?

How large is the frame of the back and how large could a stitch of several frames be? Presumably one could stich a center and then a left and right shift.

Can one do that in any direction up and down or diagonally?

Or is is the shift just to get the eye piece out of the way and have the DB go in line with the lens to take the picture?

IOW, can this be used for stitching?

What's the weight with the lens and back?

Thanks so much!

Maybe Romain might make version II, explain ing the movements!

This is exciting. Thanks so much Nicolas and Romain! anyone who needs a video for promotion knows you have a great resource on your staff and M&N Organization, bordeaux, France!

Asher

Wow!!!! Just unbelievable Nicolas. I would like just to be in the same room with it.

When are we going to see some results from it?

Asher Kelman said:

This is so exciting. I'm impressed by the apparent lightness of the instrument and how the pieces just lock in place with perfect ease and seemingly precision too. I notice that one can move the eyepiece lens axis around some center. What is that point the movement is centered on? Is it the front of the lens or lined up with the camera itself?

Click to expand...

I can't do any comparison with any view camera, but in fact it isn't that light! Of course one can hold it, but it's quite about the same weight than a 1Ds3 (without lens).
Yes, the precision is incredible and the mounting was very easy! there even were no manual with the camera!

The eyepiece can be moved in order to check the framing and look precisely at the 4 corners of the viewfinder.

Below are the specs from Sinar website:
Camera Features
Shift range: +25/-15 mm vertically, +20/-20 mm horizontally
Swing/Tilt range: +/-5°, rotatable by 360° with click-stops every 90°
Leveling aids: 1 circular and 3 tubular spirit levels for all axes
Viewing aids: Bright focusing screen with flexible 3fold magnifier
Digital back interface: Sinar Hy6, Leaf AFi interface, and Hasselblad V (as of 1Q/2009)
Tripod interface: 360° rotating mount with a 3/8" thread
Dimensions: 27 x 19 x 7 cm
Weight: 1.45 kg + Sinarback (0.6 kg) and lens

Asher Kelman said:

How large is the frame of the back and how large could a stitch of several frames be? Presumably one could stich a center and then a left and right shift.

Click to expand...

Of course! but 2 (left and right) should be enough as there will be quite a lot of overlap.

Asher Kelman said:

Can one do that in any direction up and down or diagonally?

Click to expand...

See specs above…

Asher Kelman said:

Or is is the shift just to get the eye piece out of the way and have the DB go in line with the lens to take the picture?

IOW, can this be used for stitching?

Click to expand...

Once the back is shifted in front of the lens, one may adjust its position (horizontally)

Asher Kelman said:

What's the weight with the lens and back?

Click to expand...

1.45 kg + Sinarback (0.6 kg) and lens

Asher Kelman said:

Maybe Romain might make version II, explain ing the movements!

Click to expand...

Of course! I'll have to train a "bit" and we'll do some tests, but for this, I need to find at least half a day free…
Believe it or not, since the arTec arrived I had no time to play with it! I haven't shot once!

Ron Morse said:

Wow!!!! Just unbelievable Nicolas. I would like just to be in the same room with it.

When are we going to see some results from it?

Click to expand...

Yes, an amazing piece of camera!
The answer to your question is at the end of my reply to Asher (I feel too ashamed to repeat that!)

Ok
I will shoot the new interior of the Bordeaux 60 on Feb. 24…

if I can get all the Gods with me, I'll test the beast in "real life"!

Congratulations on getting that new, wonderful, and most likely amazing piece of equipment. I know I will never have that opportunity so it was nice to at least be able to share with you the unveiling. I am counting the days, 15 of them, until your interior shoot on the Bordeaux. I know it will be spectacular. The video is superb as well. Your son was blessed with your artistic and creative genes. Thank you for showing and I look forward to what's in store.
James Newman

hi Asher,

although Nicolas has already answered your questions, let me give some indications and precisions as well:

- the tilt/swing mechanism is in front, on the lens board. It rotates around the central axis, in any position between 0° and 360°. There are click-stops at 0°, 90°, 180° and 270°/360°. When in positions 0° or 180°, the movement of the mechanism will produce a tilt (around the horizontal axis), when in the positions 90° and 270° it will produce a swing movement (around the vertical axis). Any position in-between the 0°, 90°, 180° and 270° positions shall give a combined tilt & swing movement.

- Shifts can be done in both horizontal and vertical directions, combined or not and by the amounts mentioned by Nicolas in his response. So yes, multiple stitching are possible, horizontally, vertically, and in the diagonal. How many frames depends on the overlapping you wish to have.

- the horizontal shift mechanism, integrated in the sliding part of the camera, is a very clever and patented mechanism. One sets the shift by checking on the ground glass, then the back is shifted in the position to take the picture while the shift mechanism makes sure to place the back at exactly the previously set shift, without having to control, read of the number of mm, report, etc ...: it is done automatically. So yes, obviously, it can be used for stitching, and that was the whole idea of this camera.

- There are other important features available on this camera, in fact all what one ever can imagine to need in one situation or another: pano rotation on the camera, levels in all directions, accessory shoe for possible use of a finder, principle of the lens mounted in an adjusting worm instead of just focusing through the ground-glass: in indoor areas and with ultra-short focal lengths one is simply glad to be able to control the focusing distance on the scale, etc ...

Best regards,
Thierry

Asher Kelman said:

This is so exciting. I'm impressed by the apparent lightness of the instrument and how the pieces just lock in place with perfect ease and seemingly precision too. I notice that one can move the eyepiece lens axis around some center. What is that point the movement is centered on? Is it the front of the lens or lined up with the camera itself?

How large is the frame of the back and how large could a stitch of several frames be? Presumably one could stich a center and then a left and right shift.

Can one do that in any direction up and down or diagonally?

Or is is the shift just to get the eye piece out of the way and have the DB go in line with the lens to take the picture?

IOW, can this be used for stitching?

What's the weight with the lens and back?

Thanks so much!

Maybe Romain might make version II, explain ing the movements!

This is exciting. Thanks so much Nicolas and Romain! anyone who needs a video for promotion knows you have a great resource on your staff and M&N Organization, bordeaux, France!

Asher

Click to expand...

Thierry Hagenauer said:

- Shifts can be done in both horizontal and vertical directions, combined or not and by the amounts mentioned by Nicolas in his response.

Click to expand...

I know, I still get a lot to learn with the arTec ;-) !

James Newman said:

Congratulations on getting that new, wonderful, and most likely amazing piece of equipment. I know I will never have that opportunity so it was nice to at least be able to share with you the unveiling. I am counting the days, 15 of them, until your interior shoot on the Bordeaux. I know it will be spectacular. The video is superb as well. Your son was blessed with your artistic and creative genes. Thank you for showing and I look forward to what's in store.
James Newman

Click to expand...

Thanks James! allow me sometimes for the post-processing !

Looks like a dream come true to me - how I would love to take it to Scotland!!! Have fun with it Nic, I'm certain you will, looking forward to seeing the results....

... and I eventually found the time to watch the video: superb, Nicolas, very informative in all aspects.

Thanks to your son Romain.

Best regards,
Thierry

janet Smith said:

Looks like a dream come true to me - how I would love to take it to Scotland!!! Have fun with it Nic, I'm certain you will, looking forward to seeing the results....

Click to expand...

Hi Janet

thanks for the kind words! I'm sure I'll to get some fun with it, but first I have to read and read and try and test… and read again!
The arTec is a very "simple" (though I can guess that Rainer and the Sinar team got some headaches when conceiving it!) but in comparison, the 1Ds3 looks like a point and shoot camera! LoL!
Every single setting is manual… Now I have to find a light meter as I don't think the one built-in the Canon could do the trick…

Hi Nicolas,

nice to see the real unpacking video )) ...you will love the 28mm lens to shoot the interior of the Bordeaux.

How satisfied are you at focusing with loupe on the ground glass? Any experience yet?

Karsten

Hi kartsen
Yes I thought that this video will be a good reminder for you ;;;-)

I have not enough experience, yet, with the focusing with the magnifying glass to make any comments… Sinar claims that it is the brightest one, but as it is "my" very first view camera, so I just can't tell!

What about you?

Thierry Hagenauer said:

... and I eventually found the time to watch the video: superb, Nicolas, very informative in all aspects.

Thanks to your son Romain.

Click to expand...

Hi Thierry, many thanks…
You know what? that's the reason why our customers are paying us!

Hi all
if you read this, it means that you are interested in the arTec camera…

So let me point you to the interview of another OPFer Rainer Viertlböck by Michael Heinrich in Luminous Landscape.

Quite interesting to read the whys and the hows of the camera.
it is followed by a "Practical Test by Michael Heinrich".

Good read! That's here

Nicolas Claris said:

As said before the Sinar arTec arrived some days ago as I was on the road…

After a good sleep, I could not resist to open the box, but Romain was there with his HD video camera…

If you're curious or just want to share my emotion… it's there

Click to expand...

Hi Nicolas,

It looks like you are going to enjoy the experience. It's another completely different way of shooting, but I think you will adapt to it very quickly. Hopefully you'll have some time to try out the different settings. Romain did a good job documenting the unpacking event.

Have fun,
Bart

Thanks Bart, yes, I'll get some time (till end of June) to adapt and ride the learning curve!

The arTec suitcase unveiled!

I have received some emails from some guys asking about the packing itself (cardboard box), they were quite amazed…

So I thought some precisions should be done…
What I received is a test camera, not excactly the one you will receive when you'll have placed your order!
So I asked Sinar to provide me a picture of the real "for customer" suitcase (I had quite a precise idea because when I received the Hy6, it was packed in a beautifull black, waterproof suitcase).

So here it is, the suitcase unveiled!
See how your arTec will be showcased!


Of course the exact items included may vary depending of your order… :-D

My comment?
It's a beauifull piece of suitcase, protecting your investment very well, however, the pleasure and suspense of unpacking was really great when I had to open boxes after boxes ;-)

Thanks Nicolas, to make this important precision and for the pic posted!

Kind regards,
Thierry

Nicolas Claris said:

I have received some emails from some guys asking about the packing itself (cardboard box), they were quite amazed…

So I thought some precisions should be done…
What I received is a test camera, not excactly the one you will receive when you'll have placed your order!
So I asked Sinar to provide me a picture of the real "for customer" suitcase (I had quite a precise idea because when I received the Hy6, it was packed in a beautifull black, waterproof suitcase).

So here it is, the suitcase unveiled!
See how your arTec will be showcased!

Of course the exact items included may vary depending of your order… :-D

My comment?
It's a beauifull piece of suitcase, protecting your investment very well, however, the pleasure and suspense of unpacking was really great when I had to open boxes after boxes ;-)

Click to expand...

Nicolas,

To open that case must be a thrill in itself. I want to hear how routine it can be to work with the Sinar system. I hope you, Kartsten and others will report what it's like to use every day in a work flow. How does the back work? Does the back really come to rest at the same position as the place one was looking at through the eyepiece? How reliable is it? Are images lost or are the Sinar backs a mature trustworthy system? Are issues that come up sorted out by Sinar?

I ask this because people who push Phase One or Leaf, tend to talk down Sinar. One review I saw, it was obvious that the reviewer had no idea on how to use the software. So we really would value as much reporting as possible. How many pictures you take are exposed as you'd expect from looking on the screen? It would be most helpful if we could share as much as possible so that the strengths of this system is circulated. That's not going to come from people just interested in competing backs. Here there's a real hospitality to have you set out what this important new integrated system can do. I have the highest regard for Rainer and expect all his efforts will be vindicated by the results you guys can show us!

Most of all, we want to see pictures, especially with the wide angle lenses!

Asher

Patience, my friend, is always rewarded…

hi Asher,

if you believe what I am saying, I can already answer a few of your questions here, since having used the arTec myself, as well as having got feedback from customers and distributors, not later than yesterday. This the comment from a customer yesterday, having stopped on the road with his car, for a quick shot of a landscape when he saw it while driving home from a meeting, I quote:

"The arTec is something really special—so easy to use. And eXposure 6.1.1 handles the shading so elegantly!
Congratulations to the entire development team!!!!!
Hardware AND software!!!"

My answers to your questions:

- yes, it is so easy to use, once you see how it is built and why it is built this way (Rainer did know exactly what doing). The routine comes after only a few shots with it.

- yes, the back goes EXACTLY in the position you have set it on the ground-glass: the mechanism is precise and a 100% reliable.

- images lost: it would be a lie to say this can never happen. It depends on so much parameters, which all CAN happen: switch off the back un-willingly, battery empty, un-formated or problematic/broken CF card, CF card taken out while transfer, FW plug plugged out during transfer (when tethered). etc ... This has all already happen, I can assure you. Other than this, there are some case of corrupt files from time to time, for which the cause could not be addressed and probably due to some external cause(s). But all in all, the system is reliable, and I remind here that the eMotion backs are the only backs with BOTH an internal memory AS WELL AS a CF card, with the possibility to save on BOTH at the same time, if one wants full security.

- which issues? There are no particular issues. But one cannot say or pretend that electronic does not and never fail or break. If it is repeatable, then the issue gets fixed, obviously.

- people who use/push other systems/brands always talk down Sinar. That's not new. To get an idea about Sinar, it would rather be appropriate to talk to Sinar users. We might not be the biggest player, but our customers' feedback and comments about the quality we deliver confirms us on our choices and directions. Don't forget that "talking down" somebody/something is often a sign of weakness: in this case I suspect the fact that Sinar is the only manufacturer having a WHOLE system, from large format analog and digital, to medium format analog and digital, with all possible lenses and accessories, for ALL possible needs, is what makes people envious. This being said, I won't and ever have spoken bad about other brands: they all have their advantages and disadvantages. There are IMO no bad products in this class and for these prices, or not longer. And the point you are mentioning, that people who test it out for reviews very often don't have any clue about HOW to use it the correct way and are sometimes afraid about the many features and possibilities without having control over it: it is a fact and absolutely true in 90% of the reviews. Result of this is what we all know: "images with issues" and "jumping to conclusions" which does not make the tester appear to be responsible. I try to avoid reviews, since they are ALWAYS flawed, and IMO, "test it yourself" with somebody to guide you is the right approach.

My words might seem to be biased and with an agenda. One is allowed to think so and I would not mind about it. But I can assure you that I do speak out my heart, which is the passion for photography, nothing else. And in this respect, Sinar has provided so many novelties and progress in this field, and still his.

Best regards,
Thierry

Asher Kelman said:

Nicolas,

To open that case must be a thrill in itself. I want to hear how routine it can be to work with the Sinar system. I hope you, Kartsten and others will report what it's like to use every day in a work flow. How does the back work? Does the back really come to rest at the same position as the place one was looking at through the eyepiece? How reliable is it? Are images lost or are the Sinar backs a mature trustworthy system? Are issues that come up sorted out by Sinar?

I ask this because people who push Phase One or Leaf, tend to talk down Sinar. One review I saw, it was obvious that the reviewer had no idea on how to use the software. So we really would value as much reporting as possible. How many pictures you take are exposed as you'd expect from looking on the screen? It would be most helpful if we could share as much as possible so that the strengths of this system is circulated. That's not going to come from people just interested in competing backs. Here there's a real hospitality to have you set out what this important new integrated system can do. I have the highest regard for Rainer and expect all his efforts will be vindicated by the results you guys can show us!

Most of all, we want to see pictures, especially with the wide angle lenses!

Asher

Click to expand...

Of course I don't have a long experience with the arTec, I would just add to Thierry's bottom of the heart testimony, that I did already post some pictures shot after only 5 minutes spent with Thierry to show me the camera.
I had NEVER used a view camera before…
Images are here

To be honest, the more difficult for me was last year when I started to work with the HY6.
The Hy6 is also an easy camera, when you get used to the reversed image in the viewfinder, the issue I had were with the post production…
I must say here that I have tried the latest version of eXposure (6.1.1) and yes, that's an improvement. My dear Brumbaer tools may know have a desserved rest…

I also had some very few pics lost, but most than certainly the user's fault…

The rotating adaptor is a pure jewel, on the Hy6 and on the arTec as well! it makes changing of orientation so easy and natural! (I think that in one of the video "making of" with the Hy6, one may see how it works while shooting from the helicopter…)

Hi Asher,

Asher Kelman said:

How does the back work? Does the back really come to rest at the same position as the place one was looking at through the eyepiece? How reliable is it? Are images lost or are the Sinar backs a mature trustworthy system? Are issues that come up sorted out by Sinar?

Click to expand...

the sliding adapter works perfectly as expected. I like the eMotion 75 digital back more and more - just because of the lack of needless features. No issues at all. But you have to be willing to let go everything you get with a modern dslr or point&shoot camera - you will have to learn and use the eMotion digital back in combination with the eXposure software.

Your exaggerated questions about the backs reliability just seem to curious to me... you surely do not open a nikon fe before rewinding the film, and complain afterwards that some images are lost?

Asher Kelman said:

How many pictures you take are exposed as you'd expect from looking on the screen?

Click to expand...

I don't understand - which screen? Screen on the digital back or ground glass on the arTec?

Karsten

Karsten Schneeberger said:

Hi Asher,
the sliding adapter works perfectly as expected. I like the eMotion 75 digital back more and more - just because of the lack of needless features. No issues at all. But you have to be willing to let go everything you get with a modern dslr or point&shoot camera - you will have to learn and use the eMotion digital back in combination with the eXposure software.

Click to expand...

Thanks for that information. That's a great design. Looking forward to seeing it myself.

Karsten Schneeberger said:

Your exaggerated questions about the backs reliability just seem to curious to me... you surely do not open a nikon fe before rewinding the film, and complain afterwards that some images are lost?

Click to expand...

My questions were to provide a clear opportunity for folk to explain beyond what the MFR publishes. What you say is much more important to us than what a reviewer copies from the company sales brochure. Make no mistake, I'm a very strong fan of Sinar. They are the only company to my knowledge that offers comprehensive imaging solutions covering LF and MF with their own platforms, the Hy6 and now the ArTec and their fine lenses.

We need however your reports. Others who are looking to buy a MF system will welcome your direct answer. That's the honest way to describe a camera, your own user experience. My job is to be as probing as I can.

Karsten Schneeberger said:

I don't understand - which screen? Screen on the digital back or ground glass on the arTec?

Click to expand...

What one sees on the LCD screen.

Thanks Karsten for giving us your experience. This is far more important than anything one can read from a reviewer that gets the camera for a week or a month. Someone who spends their own money for their own livelehood provides the most useful guidance for other photographers. That's why your views here are appreciated so much!

Asher

Hi Asher
from a reviewer in real life but who has not paid the equipment (a loan from Sinar) ;-)

Asher Kelman said:

How many pictures you take are exposed as you'd expect from looking on the screen?

Click to expand...

If you mean to rely on the screen for evaluating good or bad exposure, I would not do that.
Instead, the histogram is the right tool and has never fooled me since I got the reflex to use it! (though, I confess not doing this while shooting from helicopter!)
This coment is based on my experience with the Sinarback eMotion 75 LV, not the Sinarback eMotion 54 LV… I'll have to test the live view, which I never tried, but of course the IQ shown should be the same…

Nicolas Claris said:

…the one you will receive when you'll have placed your order!

Click to expand...

This may need some more infos that I grabbed on the web…:

Below the prices for the Sinar arTec camera, its accessories as well as the lenses for this camera.
First column = Product Number - Last column = Availability

2nd part: Sinar arTec - Scope of delivery

3rd part: details of the 2 available arTec Bundles (Scope of Delivery)

Best regards,
Thierry

1. Prices (Euro)

493.23.000 Sinar arTec (7'226.-) Oct. 08
493.23.011 Sinar arTec-e54r (Bundle) (15'549.-) Oct. 08
493.23.013 Sinar arTec-e75r (Bundle) (24'268.-) Oct. 08

445.87.103 Sinaron Digital 4.5/45 CEF (2'316.-) Oct. 08
445.87.105 Sinaron Digital 4.5/55 CEF (2'376.-) Oct. 08
445.87.107 Sinaron Digital 5.6/70 CEF (2'689.-) Oct. 08
445.87.109 Sinaron Digital 5.6/90 CEF (2'255.-) Oct. 08
445.87.113 Sinaron Digital 5.6/135 CEF (2'366.-) Oct. 08
445.87.158 Sinaron Digital HR 4.5/28 CEF (3'994.-) Oct. 08
445.87.160 Sinaron Digital HR 4.0/35 CEF (2'968.-) Oct. 08
445.87.164 Sinaron Digital HR 4.0/60 CEF (2'814.-) Oct. 08
445.87.168 Sinaron Digital HR 4.0/100 CEF (2'843.-) Oct. 08
445.87.156 Sinaron Digital VHR 5.6/23 CEF "to be decided" 2Q/2009

547.81.051 Adapter Ring 100/M49 (56.-) from stock
547.81.053 Adapter Ring 100/M58 (56.-) from stock
547.81.055 Adapter Ring 100/M67 (56.-) from stock
547.81.066 Adapter Ring 100/M72 R (56.-) from stock
547.81.002 Cap for Lens Adapter Ring (10.-) from stock
493.23.041 Artec Lens Hood "to be decided" 1Q/2009
551.43.097 White Shading Diffusor (65.-) from stock

493.23.043 Artec Rod Holder (59.-) Oct. 08
472.61.000 Hexagonal Rod 11 cm (10.-) from stock
472.71.000 Hexagonal Rod 16 cm (13.-) from stock
472.81.000 Hexagonal Rod 25 cm (16.-) from stock
546.31.000 Swiveling Linear Polarizing Filter (375.-) from stock

531.61.000 Accessory Shoe 32 from stock
551.64.070 Trigger Cable Emotion/Precision (62.-) from stock

2. Sinar arTec (493.23.000)

552.23.100 Sinar arTec
551.32.086 Focusing Magnifier
493.23.504 Metallic Format Mask 75
475.45.036 Sturdy Sinar arTec Case with dedicated liner

3. Sinar arTec bundles

- Sinar arTec-e54r (493.23.011)

552.23.100 Sinar arTec
551.32.086 Focusing Magnifier
493.23.504 Metallic Format Mask 75
552.36.x11 Sinarback eMotion 54 LV
552.36.085 SB eMotion/Sinar Hy6 Revolving Adapter
551.64.070 Trigger Cable eMotion/Precision
551.63.054 Firewire Cable 1394 A, 4.5 m
551.43.097 White Shading Diffusor 100
552.36.096 Sinar V290 Li+ Battery
552.36.093 Battery Charger with Mains Adapters
552.37.092 CF Card 4 GB
552.37.090 CF Card Reader
751.43.003 Gray Card
551.33.090 Digital Cleaning Kit from stock
CD with Capturing Software and Instructions Sinar arTec from stock
475.45.038 Sinar Artec System Case with dedicated liner Oct. 08
-----> Sinaron Digital CEF Lenses to be purchased separately

- Sinar arTec-e75r (493.23.013)

552.23.100 Sinar arTec
551.32.086 Focusing Magnifier
493.23.504 Metallic Format Mask 75
552.36.x13 Sinarback eMotion 75 LV
552.36.085 SB eMotion/Sinar Hy6 Revolving Adapter
551.64.070 Trigger Cable eMotion/Precision
551.63.054 Firewire Cable 1394 A, 4.5 m
551.43.097 White Shading Diffusor 100
552.36.096 Sinar V290 Li+ Battery
552.36.093 Battery Charger with Mains Adapters
552.37.092 CF Card 4 GB
552.37.090 CF Card Reader
751.43.003 Gray Card
551.33.090 Digital Cleaning Kit
CD with Capturing Software and Instructions Sinar arTec
475.45.038 Sinar Artec System Case with dedicated liner Oct. 08
-----> Sinaron Digital CEF Lenses are sold separately

Thierry, are prices and availiblty still the right ones?