• Please use real names.

    Greetings to all who have registered to OPF and those guests taking a look around. Please use real names. Registrations with fictitious names will not be processed. REAL NAMES ONLY will be processed

    Firstname Lastname

    Register

    We are a courteous and supportive community. No need to hide behind an alia. If you have a genuine need for privacy/secrecy then let me know!
  • Welcome to the new site. Here's a thread about the update where you can post your feedback, ask questions or spot those nasty bugs!

The 1Ds Flagship question!

Asher Kelman

OPF Owner/Editor-in-Chief
1DsII prices have dropped

$ 6,869.95 http://www.bhphotovideo.com
http://www.adorama.com/ICA1DSM2.html

So, who suspects what?

November? Next year? How many pixels? 22 or would say more?

Don't answer if you have an NDA!

Price?

I'd say $7500 and the 1DsII will go for $6600.

Just my guesses, based on what Apple does in their produce cycles.

And who needs this anyway?

Is this now the time to get a 1DsII before there are none left? Or else are you already satisfied where you are?

I heard a number people have been selling their 1DsII's. Just a few but do they know something?

Asher
 

Mike Spinak

pro member
What do you think?

It's gotta happen sometime. I've heard of some prototypes and test bodies in action.

How large

My guess is that it will be almost the exact same size and shape as the current 1D line bodies, but perhaps slightly lighter.


Don't let Photokina fool you; it's still a bit further down the line.

Look at the prices of 1DsII have they gone down very recently?

Ignore that, unless you are buying or selling 1DsII bodies; it is not a good predictive signal.


Mike

www.mikespinak.com
 
Okay I have to ask,
Unless you have a medium format digital, why would any "Photographer" part with a 1DsMkII before the replacement is actually available?

unless
- They were having financial or health issues. (that's how I got my old Hasselblad)
- Actually have their hands on the replacement and can keep it.
- They have more then two.
or
- They are just stupid or are not really into photography.

Short of #1 there is almost no way I would part with mine. Even if Canon comes out with something better, unless it was phenomenally better (in which case that is an occasion I would sell my old 1DsMkII to get a second). I have not even yet sold my D60 and 10D because I need a backup and want what comes next and they make adequate backups for now (it also helps they seem to have hit the floor on price).

I can not see anybody trying to make money off photography selling off their cameras until they have the new one in hand and checked it out to make sure it works. And to the extent possible you got to have a backup (even if lesser) if you are going to be professional.

Short of a medium format digital I have not yet heard of any better digital camera then Canon's 1DsMkII that is actually available (or oficially announced for that matter). So why would anyone part with the best if they did not have to?

Just kind of curious as I currently consider most sources who say they are selling their cameras before the new ones are out to be suspect as reliable.

I of course am hoping they announce later this month and release before end of year, but am expecting release in spring whether they announce now or not. There is no way I could go for more then a month without my 1DsMkII (unless it is broke and I had to)

Just my opinion and ranting/raving
 

Asher Kelman

OPF Owner/Editor-in-Chief
Of two people I know selling one is a full time fashion photographer and may well have several MF cameras too. The other does commerical work and has another 1Ds, I believe.
Tim Dolan (Longwatcher) said:
Okay I have to ask,
Unless you have a medium format digital, why would any "Photographer" part with a 1DsMkII before the replacement is actually available?

I of course am hoping they announce later this month and release before end of year, but am expecting release in spring whether they announce now or not. There is no way I could go for more then a month without my 1DsMkII (unless it is broke and I had to)

Just my opinion and ranting/raving

My guess is November!

Asher
 

Paul Caldwell

New member
I figure its going to be around 22mp but I had also figured you wouldn't see it until next spring.

I am staying with the MKII for now. I have jumped every time and most times too early as I and other do some of Canon's R&D for them.

For me the next jump is MF, and some form of Phase one back, P45 is just too much but sure would like that.

Still hoping that the 5D comes down slightly as I wouldn't mind picking one of those up, mainly due to the weight of the 1ds MKII in the field.

Paul c.
 

Roberto_Tolin

New member
I have waited for Photokina for nothing. I wanted a new 1Dx, but i needed a second camera now and bought yesterday a 5D. Great camera for the money. Better than my 1Ds (mk 1) except in wethersealing and build quality. Next 1Dx would be 23-24 mp, but i think it arrived next year.
 

Asher Kelman

OPF Owner/Editor-in-Chief
For myself, as long as I stitch, the 5D is fine for landscapes and I like the 1DII for my way of working with people as it is so fast in focussing.

For landscape, I'd love the new Seitz Scanning back 6x17 camera, 1GB files in 1-2 secs or a DB on an Ebony Camera. Both expensive dreams.

So what does a 22 MB camera offer? Well if it is 7 frames a second, for sports, I'd think one would want to be able to bin files for higher ISO. Taking 22MP and binning to 8 MP would allow the ISO 1600 to become 4800! Now that would be really great for sports, street and news photography.

If the files are really great, it might be a great landscape camera, but, for the moment, I think that the Digital back will hold their own way ahead of anything else.

Still, once the 1DsXX comes out, we'll all get envious and for $7500, they'll fly off the shelves.

Asher
 
What about a

--- Fujifilm Sx? with the body of a D200 !
I almost got a D200, but I will wait until the end of Photokina..

--- Mamiya ZD. This is of vital interest to me because I have 150mm, 80mm and 45mm AFD lenses. If it is a ZD 22MP back it would be even better.

I think that Canon is not going to show a spectacular *real* resolution gain with a 22MP or 24MP camera. It will only show the limitations of 35mm optics, so that the need to upgrade will not be as urgent --unless you are the type of photographer that needs to have the latest "muscle" camera-- This is the same with all formats in the "megapixel arms war" MF will be MF and 35mm that.
 

Asher Kelman

OPF Owner/Editor-in-Chief
The 22 MP sensor would be fine with Zeiss, Leica, Olympus or certain Nikon wide angle lenses used in manual mode.

So the lens is not a barrier at least for large group formal shoots, such as a wedding, a corporate shoot or else for detail rich landscape or architecture.

For the latter, one needs software corrections for minor lens shortcomings. However, the biggest need is for wider dynamic range and higher ISO, not more pixels.

Asher
 

Paul Caldwell

New member
Dream would be 22mp foveon

There was a rumor for a while that Canon would be coming out with something like the Foveon chip. That in 22mp would be a dream come true.

Paul c.
 

Don Lashier

New member
Paul Caldwell said:
There was a rumor for a while that Canon would be coming out with something like the Foveon chip. That in 22mp would be a dream come true.
Canon received a patent a while back that has dynamically switchable RGB filters, but I've always wondered how they'll deal with motion artifacts.

PP's comment is "not yet, but sooner than Nikon might think".

- DL
 

Joel Slack

New member
Tim Dolan (Longwatcher) said:
Okay I have to ask,
Unless you have a medium format digital, why would any "Photographer" part with a 1DsMkII before the replacement is actually available?

unless
- They were having financial or health issues. (that's how I got my old Hasselblad)
- Actually have their hands on the replacement and can keep it.
- They have more then two.
or
- They are just stupid or are not really into photography.

Short of #1 there is almost no way I would part with mine. Even if Canon comes out with something better, unless it was phenomenally better (in which case that is an occasion I would sell my old 1DsMkII to get a second). I have not even yet sold my D60 and 10D because I need a backup and want what comes next and they make adequate backups for now (it also helps they seem to have hit the floor on price).

I can not see anybody trying to make money off photography selling off their cameras until they have the new one in hand and checked it out to make sure it works. And to the extent possible you got to have a backup (even if lesser) if you are going to be professional.

Short of a medium format digital I have not yet heard of any better digital camera then Canon's 1DsMkII that is actually available (or oficially announced for that matter). So why would anyone part with the best if they did not have to?

Just kind of curious as I currently consider most sources who say they are selling their cameras before the new ones are out to be suspect as reliable.

I of course am hoping they announce later this month and release before end of year, but am expecting release in spring whether they announce now or not. There is no way I could go for more then a month without my 1DsMkII (unless it is broke and I had to)

Just my opinion and ranting/raving

I have heard a lot of complaints (unjustified, IMHO) about the size and weight of the Ds2, but it IS a concern for people. The release of the 5D may have precipitated a move from the full-frame, mp-laden Ds2 to the 5D. On another forum in the "pro Canon" section, virtually all the talk is about the 5D.

It is also possible that (as you suggested in #1) there are those who have taken the "next step" and moved into MF, which, for some, might require the sale of their Ds2 to accommodate them financially, as they would have to build their system from the ground up and would be accustomed to the multiple-lens selection they'd almost certainly have if they were using a Ds2.

Or maybe they thought the Ds2 would meet their needs for capturing critical moments, and discovered that the D2N was better suited to them. They'd already be set up on lenses, and the downshift in price might sweeten the pot even more.

Lots of serious photographers have to work on a budget and everyone has to operate within their means, and not everyone can afford to keep both series-1 Canons, or to keep a Ds2 AND absorb the cost of building a MF system from scratch.

It is possible that those people divesting themselves of the Ds2 at this juncture are doing so for reasons completely unrelated to the alleged impending announcement of a new flagship model. Sure, it pays to be smart about how you time these kinds of moves, but ultimately the decision has to be made on a 'what do I need today" basis. As previously stated, I wouldn't put too much stock into what others are doing with their Ds2's at this point. Indeed, nobody knows anything about what's coming or when.
 

Erik DeBill

New member
Joel Slack said:
I have heard a lot of complaints (unjustified, IMHO) about the size and weight of the Ds2, but it IS a concern for people. The release of the 5D may have precipitated a move from the full-frame, mp-laden Ds2 to the 5D. On another forum in the "pro Canon" section, virtually all the talk is about the 5D.

I would bet that this has much more to do with the relative prices of the 5D and 1Ds2. The 5D is less than half the price, and Canon should expect to sell at least an order of magnitude more of them. Many more people will have the 5D, thus much more talk about it. This would be true even if the 5D weighed as much as the 1Ds2.

For me, the 5D is cheap enough to be tempting. The 1Ds2 is out of my price range. If it was the same price, I might have bought one instead of embarking on my large format experiment (which is probably approaching the $3k mark at this point). I'm very weight concious (I do a lot of hiking photography), but I'm willing to carry a bit of extra poundage if it makes significantly better pictures.
 

Joel Slack

New member
Erik DeBill said:
I would bet that this has much more to do with the relative prices of the 5D and 1Ds2. The 5D is less than half the price, and Canon should expect to sell at least an order of magnitude more of them. Many more people will have the 5D, thus much more talk about it. This would be true even if the 5D weighed as much as the 1Ds2.

You're probably right.
 

Michael Fontana

pro member
Asher Kelman said:
The 22 MP sensor would be fine with Zeiss, Leica, Olympus or certain Nikon wide angle lenses used in manual mode.

So the lens is not a barrier at least for large group formal shoots, such as a wedding, a corporate shoot or else for detail rich landscape or architecture.

For the latter, one needs software corrections for minor lens shortcomings. However, the biggest need is for wider dynamic range and higher ISO, not more pixels.

Asher


Having a 1 Ds-1 for 1 1/2 years, I' m quite happy; not really looking for more MP; therefore the jump from 17 to 22 MP isn't a real argument, but as Asher statet, only new features, as a bigger dynamic rang, autocleaning - slurp - , etc would make me thinking....

I agree als on the need of better lenses, as without them, 22 MP are useless, especially in the wide angle.

Weight isn't a argument for me; but I'm a tripod-shooter anyway. I prefer the weight of the 1 Ds-2 over the 10 D's, which is the backup-cam here. Maybe it's just feel and touch...
 

ravindar bindra

New member
With other electronic equipment I typically do not upgrade for 2-3 years, so why are cameras different? If you have not yet hit the technical limits of the system that is.
 

Joel Slack

New member
I remember when 33.3 mhz was pushing the limits of computer processor clock speeds...probably the computer geeks all sat around tables in coffee shops talking about how they couldn't take the technology much farther. The future will be very interesting!! I look forward to it.
 

Stan Jirman

New member
ravindar bindra said:
With other electronic equipment I typically do not upgrade for 2-3 years, so why are cameras different? If you have not yet hit the technical limits of the system that is.
But it has been 2-3 years (read: between two and three) since the 1Ds2 came out, so you should update :)
 
Top