Free Services: What' s to lose and gain? TFP? does that work for you?

[Bart_van_der_Wolf]

We do favors. Weddings for a friend. More often it's TFP or TFCD or time for pictures or a CD of your files. How are you using this? Has it been a good experience and what have you learned from the experience?

I have shamefully copied and repurposed the following 3 posts from another current thread here. Asher

__________________________

Originally Posted by Rhys Sage

I did try offering freebie shoots but got screwed each time so now I don't do anything free.

Hi Rhys,

Allow me to ask a serious question; how does one get screwed on a freebie?
Seriously, I have an almost insatiable urge to see everything as a learning experience.

Bart

[Rhys Sage]

Originally Posted by Bart_van_der_Wolf

Hi Rhys,

Allow me to ask a serious question; how does one get screwed on a freebie?
Seriously, I have an almost insatiable urge to see everything as a learning experience.

Bart

Easily... It costs me money to drive anywhere then to have a no-show client or somebody uncooperative or something else...

People value only that for which they actually pay.

Let's see what my freebie experiences were...

1. Somebody that wanted a bridal shower shot. It was all agreed. I turned up and was told to XYZ off and that somebody else was going to do the photography. Nobody had told me!

2. Somebody wanted TFP. I said OK then found them refusing to pay for a studio and refusing to do it in their home and refusing to do it outside - not only that but they wanted to bring half a dozen "friends" along. I declined that kind offer - although I am perfectly entitled to shoot villains dead in my own home, I'm not inclined to let villains in nor to let them know where my home is. Also, while I have no objection whatsoever to shooting villains dead and even have a concealed weapons permit - I just don't want to be in a situation where I have to.

3. More bookings with no-show TFP models etc.

And a whole load of other stuff too...

Not just that but - and this is the killer - when they know you're undercharging they'll be more likely to be obstreperous and awkward. Sure - I know I am undercharging but that's for a darned good reason.

[Asher Kelman]

Originally Posted by Rhys Sage

Easily... It costs me money to drive anywhere then to have a no-show client or somebody uncooperative or something else...

People value only that for which they actually pay.

Let's see what my freebie experiences were...

1. Somebody that wanted a bridal shower shot. It was all agreed. I turned up and was told to XYZ off and that somebody else was going to do the photography. Nobody had told me!

Rhys,

That happens more than you'd imagine. Different folk in the arrangements for the party panic and invite their own "someone to cover the photography". Meanwhile one person hires pro! So of course, the volunteer has to be dismissed. The solution is call before hand and confirm that you will be the only photographer! If it's a friend, assume that you may be displaced. It happens, we just have to get over it!

Originally Posted by Rhys Sage

2. Somebody wanted TFP. I said OK then found them refusing to pay for a studio and refusing to do it in their home and refusing to do it outside - not only that but they wanted to bring half a dozen "friends" along. I declined that kind offer - although I am perfectly entitled to shoot villains dead in my own home, I'm not inclined to let villains in nor to let them know where my home is. Also, while I have no objection whatsoever to shooting villains dead and even have a concealed weapons permit - I just don't want to be in a situation where I have to.

3. More bookings with no-show TFP models etc.

TFP's are full of pitfalls. Still the idea of a fair exchange of services seems a great concept. So for example, TFP, might be great for testing a camera or lighting or a new technique. One can gain experience and also build a portfolio.

So what's your experience on free services, in exchange or not acts of generosity.

Asher

[Will Thompson]

Only give away that of which you would never be paid for but is highly valued by the recipient.

I shoot family portraits for charity where the families commonly have never had a family portrait ever do to poverty.

It gives you a warm feeling when you find out later how much it meant to them.

[Kathy Rappaport]

I started building portfolio for weddings when I did my first for a life long child hood girlfriend. I did really great photography based on what I had. I agreed upfront that my PS skills were the weak link in my photography and that I would take up to 6 months to burn a disk because my reputation was on those images. Before I shot the wedding I spent some major money on a class on shooting weddings although I was shooting 30 years but wanted to do it right. I put the unfinished images on a website and she stole them all, gave them to another classmate who is also a professional photographer to edit (who said no to all but one of her mother who died) and then told me that she wanted to select what I could use for my portfolio. We no longer speak. I ave her a disk as I promised but the finished product was going to be a Graphi Album. Saved me that money at least.

I have borrowed kids from people I know and they have welcomed my taking them off to be my models. I have done a few paid events in a subcontracted basis at a reduced rate to get experience.
I "gift" sessions to people I know when I want to shoot to try some new techniques or I go an pay for a class to practice. I spell it out up front in writing what they get and I charge for any final products. This has been the best for me. I gave the shooting as gifts and then it was welcomed and I have made a few decent sales from those gifted shoots. I have also, like Will, done a number of shoots for charity that were fruitful.

Othewise, I wouldrather pay for a model and those usually show up, take direction without demands or requiring anything but money for shooting.and I have no qualms about getting a model release. But no freebies for strangers and never again a wedding for no pay.

[Mike Shimwell]

I shot a wedding for the sister of a friend and made up a handbound album - the couple had basically no money. The only condition I made was that if anyone from the family wanted prints they should pay me a sensible, but still very low, rate to produce them. However, after asking for a CD to show other family overseas they then produced dozens of prints that decorate various homes... The silly thing is the files were not really high enough resolution or finished enough to make really good prints.

Anyway, once I got over my irritation at the dishonesty I put a couple of DVDs through the door with the raw files on and deleted the lot from my hard drive. Got to move on and it was meant to be a gift. Plus I have retained one print of a guest at the wedding that has value to me.


Quote Rhys: although I am perfectly entitled to shoot villains dead in my own home, I'm not inclined to let villains in nor to let them know where my home is. Also, while I have no objection whatsoever to shooting villains dead and even have a concealed weapons permit

You're not UK based then Rhys

Mike

[Bart_van_der_Wolf]

Originally Posted by Rhys Sage

Easily... It costs me money to drive anywhere then to have a no-show client or somebody uncooperative or something else...

Okay, I now understand what you meant with getting screwed on a freebie.

People value only that for which they actually pay.

You're right, and it's one of the points that several people made in the thread that spawned this one.

Let's see what my freebie experiences were...

1. Somebody that wanted a bridal shower shot. It was all agreed. I turned up and was told to XYZ off and that somebody else was going to do the photography. Nobody had told me!

A written agreement will help to avoid (or reduce the risk of) something like that, or at least allow to have a chance of financial compensation. A verbal agreement is also legally binding, but it's hard to prove. This also implies that when the photographer falls ill, or his car breaks down, or his camera fails, there is a risk of a claim. One should be prepared for such situations.

2. Somebody wanted TFP. I said OK then found them refusing to pay for a studio and refusing to do it in their home and refusing to do it outside - not only that but they wanted to bring half a dozen "friends" along. I declined that kind offer - although I am perfectly entitled to shoot villains dead in my own home, I'm not inclined to let villains in nor to let them know where my home is. Also, while I have no objection whatsoever to shooting villains dead and even have a concealed weapons permit - I just don't want to be in a situation where I have to.

That can happen, regardless of the price one sets. With a contract one either lets someone else follow-up, or writes off the event (tax 'benefit'). It's one of the reasons one needs a buffer in one's fees, to cover for the loss or for the additional cost to get one's money.

Not just that but - and this is the killer - when they know you're undercharging they'll be more likely to be obstreperous and awkward.

Exactly, and it can also have something to do whith the audience one attracts.

Sure - I know I am undercharging but that's for a darned good reason.

Do you see the contradiction with your observation above?

There are more methods to arrive at an attractive price, without permanently lowering the bar. One can think of package deals, discounts on a higher base price, volume benefits, etc., etc.
Just make sure you get your running cost (travel, equipment hire, insurance) paid, perhaps in advance. When you split that off from the remaining cost, the separate amounts seem lower, and more understandable.

Just some thoughts,
Bart